[mdss]

Ok guys managed to find a set of genuine club sport springs, so my question is will these be superior to the h&r's and what are the spring rates on the clubsport/h&r's is there a noticable difference over standard springs?? and just to check again my car has koni sport shocks (inserts) so i assume these clubsport springs will fit on with no problem??

As usual i would love to know peoples personal opinion on clubsport springs over h&r etc. the car does the odd strack day and is used mostly for fast road. It has mo30 rear bar poly bushes as is the front.



I know someone said yes but just double checking before i put my money where my mouth is.



thanks again much appreciated.

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[jaap]

The club sport springs have the same spring rate as the standard (ROW coupe) springs.I have installed these to replace the standard springs which lowered the car about 2cm using the Koni sportshock inserts. Also lowered the rear using the eccentric adjusters. I like this setup for (fast) street use but have no track experience. no idea aboiut the H&R.

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[flash]

correct. same as stock. 160lbs.

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[mdss]

so flash whats the correct way to go do i go for the clubsports or the h&r's or somethings else??



as i said i use the car for fast road and the odd bit of track work.

The fact the stock springs rate are the same as club sport leads me to beleive that other than a visual difference they offer little improvement or am i wrong. i dont mind loosing a lttle comfort for an improvement in handling. i will lower the rear accordingly using the eccentric bolts.



I read another post in which you said you had a cupboard full of springs so i thought i best ask you!!

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[flash]

if i were to set up a car like you describe, and you did not want to mess with the rear spring rate, then i think i would either go the clubsport springs, or somewhere about a 200lb spring. more than that and you start talking about understeer, and trying to correct that with swaybars and stuff isn't the "right" answer.



the 1" lowering H&R springs i have seen are about 230lbs. not horrible. however, they varied in lowering height from a bit over 3/4" to sometimes 1.5". it's fine when they are on the 3/4 side, but when you go to 1.5 you upset the balance because the rear eccentrics can't go that far. unfortunately you won't know until you install them. the upside is that they fit the OEM perches and do not require threaded collars and such.



tough call. that's why i have been contemplating having springs made for people that want exactly what you describe. there just haven't been enough people to justify the run yet.

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[mdss]

ah ok thanks so the clubsport springs only work with the threaded collars as my car does not have them, so maybe i will have to go for the h&r's.If they work without the collars i will take your advice and go for the clubsport springs as you suggest.#



Having read through much of what you have wriitten in the past on previous posts, i dont want to change the rear torsion bar and now with the m030 rear bar installed along with the koni sport shocks i am pleased with the results i would just like a little less body roll in the rear and thought to dial it in a little i would lower the car.

your thoughts as always would be much appreciated and also should i run the rear koni sports on fully hard or in the middle setting??



thanks flash look foward to hearing what you suggest

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[mdss]

forgot to ask also a little off topic but howsit looking for one of your short shifter kits?? you said i had to wait but the wait is painful!lol

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[flash]

no. the clubsport springs work with the OEM perches. so do the H&R, and i think one set of the hyperco. all of the others require the threaded collars.



run the konis on full soft, or at most 1/2 turn from full soft. any more than that and they will just make the back end of the car dance, and will not be doing what they are supposed to do, which is control the springs (torsion bars)



i would run the swaybar on the middle setting with OEM springs. you may need to change that if you go stiffer up front, but it depends a LOT on other things like your alignment settings and tires.



shift kits, as well as everything else are due any day now.

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[mdss]

thanks flash, will make a decision on the springs and let you know so i can get your council on the rear.

just let me know when the shifters are in. rember i am in the UK so will need shipping

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[mdss]

Flash was thinking let me know your thoughts...... as i am having a short shifter kit from you and they are due any day now, i was thinking that if you have a cupboard full of lowering springs how about i buy a set of used ones from you as the shifter kit will have to be shipped to the UK so for a small additional cost it may be worth it??



let me know i think i will go for a set of 250lb springs if you have any and regarding the brand i am happy to go with what you think eibach/h&r pi etc etc... also let me know how muchh you would want for a used set.



thanks

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[flash]

that was quite a while ago. i'm pretty sure i don't have any light springs anymore. i'll look though.



if you go the 2.5" diameter route, which requires threaded collars, then i prefer eibach. it does allow you to tweak the ride height though. 10" long springs work best, regardless of rate.

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[mdss]

i would prefer the springs without the threaded collars i meant the spring rates being 250 i think that puts me in your h&r category or maybe eibach.

let me know thanks bud

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[flash]

eibach does not make a spring that fits the oem perch.



you really only have the choice of club sport or H&R, unless somebody else new is making a spring, or hyperco is making a spring again.



hence the reason that i have considered having them made.

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[mdss]

tried to get the H&R's today seems they have stopped making the 250 rate springs and replaced them with 200's which is less than i would like.

I was offered the spax lowering springs instead have any of you used these and what spring rate are they as the shop said they would contact spax to find out, but call me ott i don't trust them to tell the truth as they now know i want 250 rate springs so they could easily tell me that just to sell them.



Or are there any others you guys recommend with around a 250 rate



thanks

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[flash]

i've never tried spax springs, but i have tried their shocks. i have no other recommendations for direct fit springs.



250 linear rate is a bit high though without adding rear springs. you'll get some understeer, and it cannot be corrected with swaybars or anything else. at 250, you should add a 90# spring in the rear. i am not surprised they stopped making them and went to the 200. that is a better match for the stock torsion bars. if the 250 was progressive, that would be fine.



i wouldn't go beyond 225 linear rate without adding rear springs or changing torsion bars.

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[mdss]

Ok got it so i need to be looking at circa 200 rates not much higher.

The thing is i can buy clubsport springs but as they are 160 rates i feel that the gain wont be much so dont want to do that maybe i'm wrong??

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[flash]

the only gain would be in the ride height and center of gravity change.



the 200# springs will firm the front end up a little, but not a lot.



there really isn't much to be done though unless you want to start on the rear. there just isn't any magic bullet for the front. adjustable struts, adjustable shocks, and a little bit stiffer spring up front, along with M030 swaybars is about as far as you can go without messing with the rear spring rate

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[DaveN]

I just changed my order to 225# from 250 as per Bobs concerns/recommendations.

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[mdss]

happy thanksgiving to all you guys in the US



I am still waiting for the spax poeple to come back to me on the spring rates so i thought i would ask flash for his definitive guide on setup.



The car has koni sport shocks(yellow). M030 front and rear roll bars poly bushes. and now with flash's recommended circa 200 rated springs how would you set the koni's up with the springs and m030 bars.



I have been running max stiffness on the koni's but after fitting the bars it doesn't seem vastly different maybe i have overwhelmed the M030 bars by setting the shocks to hard.

So please flash what do you recommend



i will lower the rear using eccentrics accordingly when the springs are in.



thanks in advance

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[flash]

with 200lb springs, set the koni struts 1 turn from full soft. that may actually end up being too stiff, but you won't know until you try it.



koni yellow sport shocks on the rear should be set either full soft or 1/2 turn from full soft on stock torsion bars.



the purpose of struts or shocks is to slow the spring down. it is NOT to stiffen the suspension. setting them too stiff causes what is called "jacking". basically you eliminate the spring from the equation and end up with a mess.



what you are looking for, to know if you got it right, on a big dip in the road, is the car will go down, up, and then down a half cycle to settle. it will do this evenly and simultaneously both front and rear. if you set the rear shocks too stiff, the front end will bounce around like a pogo stick. if you set the front too stiff, the front end will skitter on bumps and actually cost you time in the corners.

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