[ds968]

Haha, except manchego .. I love manchego ;-).

I also tend to prefer the firm, and crumbly cheeses to soft ones, although, I do like them all !! Theres not a cheese I met which I didnt t like ..even stinky ones . And goat cheese .. any day any time , Ill inhale it ! With port ! And I can live just on Ossau-Iraty and Mimolette cheese forever .

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[Roboman]

I sense we could wax lyrical about cheese for ever Dan, and yes Mimolette is a favorite. At the end of Summer we held a cheese and wine party for about 45pax. The party was fun but the best bit (don't tell the guests) was after they'd gone..... we were left with tons of cheese of all varieties. The fridge was full of cheese. It looked great, and of course had to be eaten before going off. Life is tough, but someone had to do it

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[Roboman]

Hi Chris / Dan, I thought I'd bring this back from being hijacked by cheese lovers .... to a continued discussion on wine.  So I took some photos whilst out walking and then driving. Chris I don't know the production techniques so I thought these pics might be interesting.

 

So this first one shows two types of harvest and also two types of autumn trimming.

On the left is machine harvesting where the harvester runs astride the vines, banging the base and causing the bunches to drop onto a conveyor.  As the grapes move along the conveyor to the hopper they pass blowers which blow off the leaves and loose stalks. It has also been partly trimmed by machine; a little tractor fits between the rows and spinning blades trim the vines vertically.  Later a vigneron will go back along the rows trimming it further down onto the wires.

 

The field on the right is set up for hand picking and trimming ..... nothing else to say about that really except that the quality of the harvest is higher because the undesirable stalks etc are minimised.  There's much more to say, it just depends on how interested you are.

 

   

 

Looking North from where we were walking is this view.  The castle is Aguilar, and as you possibly agree, the colours of Autumn are quite spectacular!!

 

   

 

Looking South is the Pyrenees range

 

   

 

 

The guy in orange is trimming his vines.  He wearing orange so the pig hunters won't shoot him by mistake.  Ironically in the background is the village cemetery, just in case the orange jacket doesn't do the trick.

 

   

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[Chris Vais]

Machine picked fruit is common in California. Almost all machine picked fruit is used in wines produced for the mass market. Head trained vines are becoming less common. Mostly seen in older vineyards. California is blessed to have many vineyards that were planted in the 1880s and 1890s that still produce fruit. Old vine fruit is highly prized by winemakers for the concentrated flavors fruit from old vines can deliver. Seghesio, a Sonoma Co. vintner produces a number of old vine Zinfandels and some Petit Sirah from the San Lorenzo vineyard that was planted in the 1880s. Acorn, also in Sonoma Co. produces a field blend Zinfandel from a 100 year old vineyard.

 

The shortage of qualified labor is becoming a problem in California and may well result in more mechanization in vineyards. When I first got started working in vineyards, I worked alongside Latino works who came up from Mexico. The viticultural skill of these works increased as the California Wine industry increased in importance. Today they are a very valuable resource that has been threatened by US immigration policies. In the past couple of years, I've had to harvest fruit myself with the help of friends and winery staff when we were unable to secure a picking crew.

 

You see more mechanized pruning used these days. Usually only the long canes are removed mechanically and the fine pruning work is still done by hand, by highly skilled vineyard workers. Improper pruning will negatively impact vine productivity.

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[Roboman]

Pretty much the oldest vines in France date to the beginning of last century when the French vines were decimated by phylloxera and had to start again. I'm assuming you know that the French vines are all grafted onto American root stocks (I'll bet that hurt here!) as there is still no cure against the pest. I read the Zinfandel is possibly the oldest vine in the US, with some dating back 125+years; lower yield per hectare but a more intense taste.


The other major difference, in this region especially, is the size of the plots. You can see the small fields in the photo looking to the Pyrenees. There's a couple of reasons for this, one is the Napoleonic law dictating all sibling inherit equally; which could mean chopping up land, or doing nothing because nobody can agree, and the other reason is the rules of some of the cooperatives, eg a single wine farmer must have at least Carignan, Syrah, and Granache as part of there harvest. So instead of having economies of scale, it works in the opposite direction.

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[Rap]

The rule of law.

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[Roboman]

[quote name="Rap" post="188379" timestamp="1575284503"]The rule of law.[/quote]


Yes, unfortunate and all pervasive in that property (housing) can suffer the same fate. We know a lady who lives next door to where she grew up. The mother left her house to the kids, and it has been empty for 45 years because they couldn't agree on what to do and so did nothing. Imagine??

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[Rap]

Sounds like there is more to that story.

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[ds968]

[quote name="Roboman" post="188383" timestamp="1575327963"]Yes, unfortunate and all pervasive in that property (housing) can suffer the same fate. We know a lady who lives next door to where she grew up. The mother left her house to the kids, and it has been empty for 45 years because they couldn't agree on what to do and so did nothing. Imagine??[/quote]


Ah, the downside of nepotism .. it’s not always that nepotism works out as seamlessly as it does here in the White House .. ;-) .

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[Rap]

Sure you're using the correct word? Wouldn't inheritance or executor be more accurate or could you just not help getting in line to take a shot? There is a family that obviously had no conversation prior to death as to the owners wishes. Having just lost my Dad I am grateful for proper planning and conversation among family members so everyone is on the same page. I still think there is more to the story. Who paid the taxes?


Whats this have to do with wine?

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[ds968]

 

Whats this have to do with wine?

  This ?  ( assuming all of it applies to wine growing plots  )  :

 

" The other major difference, in this region especially, is the size of the plots. You can see the small fields in the photo looking to the Pyrenees. There's a couple of reasons for this, one is the Napoleonic law dictating all sibling inherit equally; which could mean chopping up land, or doing nothing because nobody can agree, and the other reason is the rules of some of the cooperatives, eg a single wine farmer must have at least Carignan, Syrah, and Granache as part of there harvest. So instead of having economies of scale, it works in the opposite direction "

 

So one sibling gets the granache grapes, the other gets the syrah ones, and  so on.. simple !      Ask yourself  WWND ?    ( what would Napoleon do )  

 

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[Roboman]

Hi Rap, I'm just back from Barcelona ......I'm very sorry for your loss, and trust you are okay even though we have never met. I shall briefly explain and then cease this thread so as not to extend any difficulties ..... Napoleon created a "shared inheritance" in order to stop "first children" being disinherited through later marriages. So in the example of land/vines the siblings would need to agree as to sell, divide, etc.. If they cannot agree then nothing happens, cf untended vines/ the mother's house as previously mentioned. It is still the case that I can draft a will to leave all I own to my second wife ..... and that my will has no effect. My kids from first marriage would have precedence over my will to the extent that my present wife could live in our house but not sell it as she would not own it. We were very surprised to learn this after we settled in France. I suspect that in the USA you can "will" your property etc to whoever you wish, it is not the same in France. Enough of this. Again, Rap, I'm sorry for your loss and am sorry if this conversation has caused difficulties. Best wishes, Robert

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[Rap]

Thanks for the apologies but no difficulties caused. I’m blessed with a strong family and while my Dad is and will remain sorely missed life goes on. I was unaware of that peculiarity in French law. It is always interesting to learn new things.

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[Roboman]

Chris I have another wine question.... In my sideways photo earlier in the Covid thread you will see a small wooden barrel. My wife bought it last Summer, and inside was some fairly pleasant sweet wine. Only a couple of litres, as the guy selling the barrel was also drinking the wine whilst he still owned it!

To my question ....last week I decided to top up the barrel with our own wine from this year's harvest; a chance to experiment. I've done that, and first impressions are quite good. The original wine in the barrel was a little too sweet for me, and by comparison our wine is a little too light ( but last year's definitely improved in the bottle). So now I have 20L+ in the barrel .... and the tap drips!! About a cup a day is dripping out which I could either drink or pour back into the top. I favour the latter as the experiment was meant to be about oaking as well as blending, so if I drink it it'll be gone before it can mature.

Am I spoiling the wine by pouring it back in??? I estimate the alcohol content to be around 17%, but I will get a better fix on that if needs be... can I use a hydrometer or do I need to access an alcohol meter? Don't worry about the second Q as I can look that up, but I would value your experience/expertise about "recycling".

Cheers, Robert

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[Chris Vais]

Rules for barrel storage.

 

1. Exposure to the oxygen in the air will cause wine to spoil. Therefore, do not put wine leaking from the tap back in the barrel, drink it or use it for cooking. 

 

2. Wine barrels loose moisture to the environment. You should check the level of the wine in the barrel every three months under normal circumstances. But, with a leaking tap you will need to check much more frequently. If the barrel is airtight, the loss of moisture will cause the barrel to pull a vacuum which you will notice when you remove the bung. With a leaking tap, your barrel is not airtight, you should begin by replacing the tap. You should be able to get a replacement tap at a winery supply business. You can replace the the tap by turning the barrel on end. If no tap is available, I would still remove it and replace it with with a wooden or plastic plug. Once the barrel is airtight, you should be able to age wine in it.

 

3. You said that your 2019 vintage was a little light bodied. Barrel aging will correct that problem. Loosing moisture concentrates the wine flavors and topping the barrel with wine will enhance it.

 

4. When the wine has aged to your satisfaction, empty the barrel, bottle the wine that came out of it, wash out the barrel and refill with more wine.

 

5. If the barrel is going to be unused for a period of time, it needs to be sulfured. This can be done with a sulfur candle or with a solution of potassium metabisulfite. You can get the metabisulfite at a winery supply store.

 

6. All of your homemade wine, whether in the barrel or carboys, and at the time you bottle it should be treated with metabisulfite to concentration of no more than 25 parts per million. Metabisulfite is the preservative that keeps wine from spoiling.

 

7. Every time you remove the bung to check the wine level you need to sanitize it by spraying with a solution of 20% metabisulfite or alternatively you can use unflavored vodka, neutral grape spirits (grape vodka). In a pinch, use grappa or Evercleafr ( 190 proof grain alcohol) if available in France.

 

7. Absent a wine lab, you have to rely on your nose and palate to determine wether the wine is ok or has begun to spoil.

 

8. Alcohol can be determined with a hydrometer which is satisfactory for home made wine. If you were a winery, selling your product, you have a lab determine the alcohol content. In the US, the amount of excise tax a winery is required to pay is based on the volume produced and the alcohol content.

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[Roboman]

Thanks Chris, very clear and helpful. I was afraid you would say change the tap as it's a lovely old brass one. No matter, I shall find a substitute as I do wish to use the barrel. Until then I shall plug the hole, which leads to another problem ..... my wife suggested we took the tap out and put a cork in instead, so now I'm going to have to tell her it was a good idea ☹️☹️☹️☹️

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[Rap]

Use it to your advantage. Compliments are a useful management technique and manipulating tool.

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[Roboman]

[quote name="Rap" post="189282" timestamp="1584960713"]Use it to your advantage. Compliments are a useful management technique and manipulating tool.[/quote]

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[Waylander]

I'm sure you could get the tap repaired, almost all brass taps can be fixed,

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[Roboman]

[quote name="Waylander" post="189284" timestamp="1584984441"]I'm sure you could get the tap repaired, almost all brass taps can be fixed,[/quote]

Yes probably could given the right sort of machine shop, so I may think about that for the future-thanks. But right now I need to seal the barrel, so I've tipped it up and put a cork in it.

Now I just need to install some new rods on the trellis, and I'm free to work on my 968 - yippee!

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