[biosurfer1]

Convulsing? Hallucinating? Uncontrolled muscle movement? Where the hell did you get any of this? This guy had TRACE amounts of caffeine in his system and the only reason it was even mentioned is because it was the ONLY substance that had any measurable amount by both labs that tested the samples. He passed field sobriety test, he passed the breathalyzer test and yet he was still arrested and then 10 months later they decide to press charges and have not presented any supporting evidence why. 

 

This is 100% complete BS, trumped up charges unless there is a huge piece to the story they haven't mentioned.

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[flash]

let's not get stuck in the minutia of an individual case and its merits.  the bigger picture is far more interesting

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[lbpesq]

Biosurfer, how do you know how much caffeine the guy tested for? It's not in the article linked to this thread. This is a good example of the problems with forming an opinion about a criminal case based on media reports. In my 30 years of practicing criminal defense in California, I have been involved in numerous cases that drew media attention. In my experience, if the press gets it 40% accurate, they are doing an unusually good job. Just last month, one of my cases was covered in a story on the front page of the San Francisco Chronicle. While it is always nice to see my name in the paper, they completely misreported what had actually happened in the case. Again, the question here is whether the driver is operating the vehicle in an unsafe manner due to the effects of a drug, any drug.


Bill

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[Rap]

The constant seems to be the continual misreporting by the media. No wonder Trump won. I wonder if he drinks coffee?

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[Waylander]

no he owns the coffee....

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[ds968]

Bill, I will agree that there may be a possibility ( albeit an extremely rare one ) of any given person overdosing on caffeine to the point of being "driving-impaired " . And no, he / she should not get a free pass just because the substance is caffeine . I get that your focus is on the impairment , not the substance , whereas my focus, and the focus of this entire case IS the substance, and for good reason ; introducing and allowing a substance as benign as coffee, used daily by more than 85 % of people behind the wheel without any historical problems resulting from such, to enter and be heard in our the courts system in the form of a DUI charge is entirely unjustified and absurd. But it's what RAP and Flash said is what's more important than this single case; the greater potential impact on the entire driving society, not just a minority of drunk and drugged drivers out there - this could be the catalyst and an excuse for countless state agencies to go berserk and abuse their powers using caffeine in what would be the lamest of reasons to extract money from perfectly sober drivers. And maybe that's a paranoid view and this could never happen here even if the charge sticks in this case, but I think the mere possibility of this opening the door into a far reaching m.o. by law enforcement and other regulatory agencies is scary.


p.s. See my upcoming post on the for sale threads : two 968 aftermarket fold-out coffee cup holders.

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[lbpesq]

I'm the first one to suspect the government. I've been dealing with unethical conviction motivated prosecutors, "testilying" cops, and biased judges for 30 years. Nevertheless, I have no fear that the government will now start charging everyone with DUI for coffee. Heck, consider alcohol? A great percentage of the adult driving population uses alcohol to some extent, yet we don't see everyone charged with alcohol DUI. DUI is a conduct-based offense, not a substance- based offense (with the single exception of alcohol over a fixed amount). The possibility of caffeine, cold medicine, or any other drug being the source of a DUI is nothing new. If you really want to have a concern for improper DUI prosecutions, you are going to see it with cannabis. The actual scientific studies show that cannabis is not nearly as detrimental to driving ability as the general public perceives, especially when the person is an experienced cannabis user. Cops and prosecutors, who don't like the new cannabis laws, will likely seek to take advantage of this inaccurate perception.


Bill

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[flash]

i call b.s. on the effects of cannabis not being detrimental.  as somebody who has worked in the entertainment business for 30 years, i can say for a fact that when my guys are using pot, they are far less effective, productive, and responsive.  they are slow, unfocused, and require constant supervision.  the musicians are not "more creative" either.  they are just sloppy.  denying that this effect exists is ridiculous.

 

i don't care what anybody does in the privacy of their own home, and i get the desire to "let go" and use something, be it wine, booze, or pot to help get there, but we absolutely need thc tests, just like bac tests for driving.  nobody should be driving a car with either in their system.  keep that crap at home.

 

just a few sources showing that cannabis negatively affects your ability to drive.

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/600655

http://www.well.com/user/woa/fspot.htm

http://www.healthline.com/health/addicti...ts-on-body

https://www.dutch-passion.com/en/grow-in...-cannabis/

http://medicalmarijuana.procon.org/view....nID=000233

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Effects_of_cannabis

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[flash]

as for the original issue, we allow way too many people to drive that have no business behind the wheel.  our testing is grossly inadequate.  we should be testing hearing, peripheral vision, and reflexes, on a regular basis, and especially in a field sobriety test.  i have a 93 year old father in law that absolutely should not be driving anymore, and his wife is even worse.  she is nearly deaf, completely blind in one eye, and has a history of getting into accidents.  still, the DMV lets them drive.

 

i don't care what it is in your system that causes you to be impaired, be it sugar, caffeine, booze, pot, or just plain being tired.  if you can't pass the field sobriety/impaired driver tests mentioned above, you get nailed.  it should be that simple.

 

i have always felt that a driver's license is a precious thing, and having one is a privilege not a right.  i have always felt that we should be doing like other countries, and charge a lot to allow somebody to have one, and subject people to strict tests in order to qualify for one.

 

i also think california needs to catch up with the most of the rest of the country, and enact no fault insurance.

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[biosurfer1]

What a shock, they dropped the DUI charges today. Made sure to keep the reckless driving charges to use as leverage against the lawsuit that will be forth coming.

 

I'm surprised they dropped the charges, should have been a slam dunk case with the guy convulsing and hallucinating from having a coffee after work

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[ds968]

I have little doubt they regained their sanity ( during a coffee break perhaps ) and probably realized the strong potential of the judge's wrath ripping them a new a-hole for wasting his or her time with such nonsense so i think they'll be very happy with just the reckless driving part, unless the DUI attempt crap pisses off the court to the point where they'll dismiss any traffic infraction altogether .                 

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[flash]

it's not the caffeine.  its the masking of the underlying impairment.  this would really be no different than wearing a big coat to hide a gun.  you could be nailed for carrying the gun AND for concealing it.  once they figure out how to test for fatigue, and then you drive anyway, and if you try caffeine to try to get past it, they can nail you for driving with the fatigue, and for then trying to conceal it.

 

you guys need to prepare yourselves.  the climate is tightening up when it comes to driving.  it's slow, but it's happening.  all they have to do is figure out how to test for stuff, and they will be yanking more people off the road, because doing so can generate revenue via the fines and such.  those fines are steep too.  politicians love to carry the safety banner, and that's exactly what will be the selling point of prosecuting any impairment cause.  it will start with truck drivers.  it already has in terms of fatigue.  the fines for exceeding the maximum number of hours in a day is huge.  they can use that precedent and apply it to everyday people.

 

it's the nature of our litigious society to seek out someone to blame and then get paid for it.  this has only just begun.

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[az968]

This entire problem set will be solved when we are at a 100% self-driving and self-aware automobile environment.  That will eliminate all DUI and "too old to drive" and related scenarios. In a few years the technology will be solid and the government should then take the step of removing all "driver-controlled" cars from the road.  Only allowing government-authorized cars on the roads will eliminate accidents, create a huge demand for new cars (big profits for the auto industry) and remove unsafe fossil-fuel guzzling cars from the roads thus solving the global-warming concerns at the same time.  Except for me, I'll just keep riding my unicorn.

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[ds968]

You and me both... they'll have to pry my driver- controlled, fossil fuel car from my dead cold hands !

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[ds968]

And then just when we thought we saw it all, there's this : ( the story is fairly old though..)    

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[Rap]

Pussy Galore. Reminds me of a story of mine the night before I left for law school. The truth is stranger than fiction!

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[ds968]

Not sure on which episode this was, since dont watch the show , but I got this clip and though it was good for a chuckle ( not that theres anything funny about accidents caused by DUI drivers, but still.. ) so just sharing :


https://youtu.be/rlJ3pOdYnw0


One of my favorite all time remarks on DUI was from a comedian , but unfortunately I dont remember who he was ( I think it may have been Robin Williams , but not at all sure ..)

It was after MADD ( mothers against drunk drivers organization ) ran a TV campaign , with the following statement highlighted :

30 % of all automobile accident fatalities are caused by drunk divers !

His line was : that statistic only tells me than the other 70 % of fatalities are caused by sober drivers .. so it seems we all have a hell of better chance if everyone on the road drove drunk ! . :LOL:

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[MCL968]

Surprisingly, not one of the most popular TV shows in my little town.

 

The backstory for the show is interesting, and does, in fact, involve Reno.

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