[parptarf]

So I'm planning on going for a coilover setup some time next year. Why? Well, I like coilovers. <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/biggrin.png" class="smilie" alt="" />

By the time I'm set to get this setup I'd already have Lindsley racing M030 sway-bars with normal rubber bushings on the car. The car is daily driven, but I'm going to drive autoslalom, trackdays and maybe a few hillclimbs next year. Not looking for a pro setup, just something all around to have fun with. However, adjustability is nice so I can set the car up for different types of driving.

I'm not too concerned about a stiff ride, as long as it's not too stiff. (If you get what I'm saying)



Right now I'm looking at either the H&R Clubsport setup or a KW Clubsport setup. I'll look into other stuff too but it need to be Tüv-certified so I can use it on the street here in Norway.

I'm looking for a setup so I can get rid of the big and heavy torsion bar and still be able to use teh car daily.

Anyone have any tips to using these types of set ups?





(Did a quick search and read some threads already)

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[flash]

lol - you won't really lose weight with a coilover setup. the torsion bars are not heavy. depending on the springs you choose, you could actually gain weight.



i could recommend a better working setup, but it's not TUV certified, so no help to you.



keep in mind, that if you delete the torsion bars, you have to go polybronze torsion bushings and spherical bearings at the trailing arm. if i had to do it over again, i would not have deleted the torsion bars.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[parptarf]

Hmm. They're claiming a 25kg weight loss at the rear.



So coilovers together with the torsion bars. How would that work?

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[flash]

lol - not a chance. been there done that.



the torsion bars are only 10lbs for the pair, and the rubber on the ends is another pound each. then you have to add back in the coil springs, adaptors, and polybronze bushings. the shocks themselves, and the inner bushings are a wash. the most you will save is about 7-8lbs.



if you want to run coilovers with the torsion bars, then you just have to add a helper spring (flat wire - almost no spring rate) and coupler to keep the main springs in place during wheel drop. beware of those companies out there who will try to sell you a "bolt on" kit. it will lift the rear of the car without the helper spring. the only limitation of this setup is that you can't lower the car beyond what the eccentrics will allow, unless you reindex.



if i had to do it over again, i probably would have changed out my torsion bars for bigger ones. i didn't do that because of the nightmares i've heard about of people having to do it 3 times to get the indexing right. i thought it would be simpler to delete them. i was wrong. it took me a really long time to work out a package that gives me a smooth ride, while providing better cornering and handling. still, it's not as smooth and quiet as the torsion bars were, and certainly requires more maintenance.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[parptarf]

But why can't I just remove the torsion bars and keep the stock bushings?

That's how everyone else I've talked have set up their coilovers on 931s, 944s and 968s. And that's how the Tüv certification says I should do it.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[flash]

because the rubber is too soft and won't hold the load of the car by itself. the torsion bar is what keeps it in place. without that, it wiggles all over the place. if you know somebody doing that, they have no idea what they are doing. that's a very scary idea. you can move the trailing arm left to right quite easily with no torsion bar. i know. i did it that way at first. the rear suspension would move almost an inch left to right.



you have to use either delrin bushings, which make noise (i had those at first, and dumped them), or the polybronze.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[parptarf]

Got it. I might be thinking off a different bushing. Those guys who's done it definitely knows what's up.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[flash]

they might be talking about the inner control arm bushing. there is no specific "need" to change that one just because you are deleting the torsion bars.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[parptarf]

That's the one. I asked one of them again and the torsion bushing was definitely not stock.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[flash]

yup - those buggers are pricey too. they also require regular lubing. like i said, if i had to do it over again, i'd keep torsion bars. just not sure what rate i would like. i finally installed a stacked setup that gives me back the stock ride while still firming things up in the corners. not sure i could get there with torsion bars or not.



VERY slippery slope here grasshopper.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[parptarf]

Oh yes, indeed. <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/wink.png" class="smilie" alt="" />

But what type of setup would you reccomend instead? Only springs need Tuv.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[flash]

i'll have to put some thought into that one. budget will be a big factor here. TUV will be another one. if they are getting involved in springs, i would think they would also be getting involved in shocks and struts

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[parptarf]

They only involve themselves in the suspension of it alters the height I believe. Never seen anyone get any hassle from anything by upgrading the shocks.

My yellow Konis doesn't have Tüv papers on them and I don't need them to either, my TechArt springs do however.



Considering the price of a Tüv-certefied coilover setup(just the coilovers themselves) is 16.000NOK budget is fairly high too.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[flash]

ok - knowing that you have koni yellow sports up front helps. since you have tech art springs, i assume they are the OEM diameter. if there are no plans to change them, that tells me what rate they probably are, which would determine what rate to run at the rear. it also tells me how low the front is, and that you won't get level with just the eccentrics (you will fall short by about 12mm), so we are then back to playing with the torsion bars no matter what we do to spring rate.



please verify your intentions regarding the front springs, and if to be used then confirm which ones they are, and we can proceed from there.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[parptarf]

If I were to go for a non coilover setup Id prefer to keep them. But I wouldn't need to do this.

I'm not sure what type of Tech Art springs they are so I'll have to look it up. The car has been lowered at the back and have yellow konis there too.





Also keep in mind I'll be running M030 sway bars front and rear soon enough.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[flash]

it's going to be all about the spring rate and ride height of the front.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[parptarf]

From what I can find on the springs:

Distance from the wheel arch to the wheel center 320mm

And number of coils looks like 10,9/11.5



The Tuv papers are in German so I'm having a little hard time here. <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/wink.png" class="smilie" alt="" />

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[flash]

yeah - those sound like the ones i had, which led me down the slippery slope in an attempt to level out the car.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[parptarf]

When you say level. Do you mean ride height?

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[flash]

yes. this affects the corner balance quite a bit.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.