[apex]

Squeal..... shuddder.... stall.... sh*t! A toothed belt wouldn't squeal like that right?? I said to myself as I re-started the car.



Anyway popping the hood revealed it was the A/C compressor smoking at the pulley.



So.



Griffith's has those nice Kuehl Kits which make the car good for 134a (my cab is an early '92, which until yesterday blew nice and cold.) New hoses, fitting, drier, compressor, o-rings, etc come with the kit.



I'm just soliciting testimonials or advice regarding replacing the compressor. Anyone installed the Griffith's kit? Do you guys think it necessary to replace condenser also? I like the idea of a completely new system. I also like the idea of saving $325 and stick with the old.

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[unknown4u]

I didn't fit the griffith kit, but when I changed to 134a I renew al the rubber o-rings inside the system. Because my condesor was damaged I als o replaced it.

I changed also the hoses etc. This because al the parts are at age.

I would not stuck by an old part in the future so I recommand you to change most of the parts. At least I did.

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[jaap]

[quote name='unknown4u' post='51883' date='May 4 2008, 07:45 PM']I didn't fit the griffith kit, but when I changed to 134a I renew al the rubber o-rings inside the system. Because my condesor was damaged I als o replaced it.

I changed also the hoses etc. This because al the parts are at age.

I would not stuck by an old part in the future so I recommand you to change most of the parts. At least I did.[/quote]



Did you also replace the compressor or is the old one suitable for r134a as well?





Jaap

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[unknown4u]

The old one is suitable but, you have to flush it because the oil must changed too.

The old oil cannot work together with R134a.



In my case the pump also had a failure so I changed it as well.

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[RS Barn]

There are different hoses required for swap fom '92 model to later style

Pete

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[unknown4u]

The main reason was that I would not have the system stuck again by using old hoses, but is is true that they don't like R134a.

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[apex]

Griff's kit is in hand - plus new condenser also. After reading on the differences between r12 and r134 I decided the greater efficiency of the new condenser was reason to upgrade.



unknown4u is right - I think replacement of as many seals, hoses, and other parts is a good idea - especially since these cars are getting long in the tooth. The Griffith's kit is nice and complete: barrier pressure hose, correct O-rings, fittings, oil, etc.



The only thing I don't have on hand at this pont is a new expansion valve.



Here's a mystery: the '92 valve can be had for $40. The '93 valves are $100! What's the difference?

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[apex]

[quote name='rdhayward' post='52186' date='May 9 2008, 10:54 AM']If you have an R12 system, I would recommend keeping it an R12 system.[/quote]



<img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/cool.gif" class="smilie" alt="" /> OK, this is getting complicated.



I've been talking with Charlie Griffith (griffiths.com) and reading his website - which analyzes the r12 /r134 question. He's crystal-clear that r134 will work great *if* the job is done properly.



rd, check out his r12 vs. r134a page (no affiliation) and see what you think.



And get this: the local go-to AC shop also said stick with r-12. AC-man also said he didn't like working on Porsches! So I'll be shopping around for a Porsche-friendly facility while I continue to research this question.



Any other '92 model-year owners running r134a who would like to comment?

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[apex]

A note regarding changing the hoses - it's true the 134 molecule is smaller than the r12 and will leak through non-barrier hose. But the rate of leaking is very slow. Therefore, a 911, with forty feet (!) of AC refrigerant hose, benefits greatly from a complete hose upgrade if converting from r12. The hose length in our cars is much shorter so practically speaking there's no need to change - unless the hose is already degraded or otherwise in need of replacing for other reasons. Or so I've been told.

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[flash]

an option, often overlooked, is enviro-safe - fully compatible with both systems, and inexpensive as well

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[apex]

[quote name='rdhayward' post='52327' date='May 11 2008, 10:32 PM']Molecule size?....Here, smoke this, then get back to me on molecule size! <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/tongue.gif" class="smilie" alt="" />[/quote]



Ha. I'm smokin' the good stuff everyday! <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/biggrin.gif" class="smilie" alt="" />

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[flash]

dave greimann first turned me onto it - he has been running it for a while, and the last i heard, it was working very well - in fact, better than the original 134



i'm not using it yet, but if for any reason i have to change refrigerant, i will go this route

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[blue968]

Spoke to Griffith today and he was a huge help and very knowledgeable, a great guy. His number is stored in my phone!!!!

Anyway my system would start out cold then turn warm as the day got warmer so I felt it was low on freon. I bought a bottle of 134a from auto parts store and added it. Well the results were fantastic but now I was getting nervous I overcharged it, so I went to Harbor Freight and bought a set of A/C guages and the high side was reading around 350lbs and it didn't look correct, so I called Griffith and I'm glad I did. I did indeed overcharge it!!! The stupid Gauge that the cans come with are junk and could cause allot of money in damage. The guage on the bottle from parts store told me I was low which is why I added more, well I was adding to much!! Now its running about 25-30lbs on low side and 215lbs on high side at idle, the ambient temp was about 85 degrees, blowing ice cold at around 45 degrees
So moral of the story, Griffith is a great guy and be cautious of the part store recharge bottles.

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[jeff968]

Anyone done a compressor replacement? My system was converted to R134A but I lost all my refrigerant and believe my compressor is leaking. I have a replacement. It looks like a pretty simple replacement. How many o-rings where the hoses connect? Will I need anything else? Thanks

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[apex]

Jeff - I replaced my compressor with the brand sold by Griffith's - mechanically it's pretty straightforward. I think there is one o-ring for each of the two refrigerant lines. The stock compressor has amazingly stout refrigerant line connections - each one is held in with an 8mm bolt as I recall.

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[jeff968]

"Jeff - I replaced my compressor with the brand sold by Griffith's - mechanically it's pretty straightforward. I think there is one o-ring for each of the two refrigerant lines. The stock compressor has amazingly stout refrigerant line connections - each one is held in with an 8mm bolt as I recall.
"

Thanks Apex, why did you change brands and not just pick up a used Porsche unit? It looks like just the one belt? When doing reassembly you just clean the surface and insert the new o-rings and put it together? Did you do the recharge as well? Thanks!!!

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[apex]

Ha - maybe it was due to the sales skills of Charlie @ Griffiths. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif[/img] My car is an r-12 original, I wanted it as cold as possible with 134, I figured I'd go with the putatively better condenser and compressor designed for r-134. Can't say I'm disappointed with the results, but I don't have a control to compare the results to.

One thing that was drilled into my head from many sources is the importance of keeping the AC innards absolutely clean. If I'm not mistaken a blown compressor can sometimes spew junk and compromise performance later - therefore I decided to replace as much as I could.

I did the heavy lifting myself and changed out the hardware, taking care as noted to re-cap hoses and hard pipes opened up. Then took it to an AC pro to flush, charge, test, and adjust. And yes, it's just the one belt.

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[jeff968]

Thanks Apex. My R12 has been out of commision for years. I had the system upgraded but it only blew cold for a day or two. The place that did the upgrade job told me they guessed the compressor is leaking and should be replaced so that is where I'm at.

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[banditsc]

The front seal on the compressor is pretty easy to replace. That's the one that normally always leaks, even rebuilt ones seem to leak from there. The seal is maybe $10. There is a good article here on rebuilding them, normally you don't need to go the full route of pulling the case apart, just the front seal. http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarticles/9...nso_rebuild.htm

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[apex]

that's a good link banditsc - thanks!

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