[968rz]

Hey all,

I have an odd question that many will know nothing about.



I developed a leak at the ATF return line on the trans side. It is coming from the o-ring. I replaced the o-ring several times (with ones I had around) but the leak would get worse with anything other then the original.

I gave in and ordered new ones from the father land and the leak is still there (same as the original). Right now I have the correct one in as well as a second on the nut side of the flare, it has slowed big time but still leaking. Anyone have any ideas, could this be an issue with the trans line(I can't see any holes)?

I was looking at all the posts in all the forums for any one with this sort of thing and found none.

<img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/mad.gif" class="smilie" alt="" />

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[unknown4u]

Is it possible that you post a picture made with your celphone?

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[PorscheDude]

Is there supposed to be an O-ring on either side of the nut?



You could add some UV leak detector, that may show where the leak originates more clearly.

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[968rz]

I didn't take pics when I had it apart, I don't really want to take it apart again as its not leaking TOO bad (need to drop the exhaust and such to get at it)



There is only supposd to be one o-ring on the the trans side (see link part #15)

PET diag

NO need for a trace; the fluid comes right out of the hole where the tube pass' into the nut.

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[PorscheDude]

Perhaps you need a new line. Did you clean the fitting to insure there is no pitting or corrosion on it before you reassembled?



You might be able to remove the line and take it to a hydraulic shop and have them make you a new line. Should be under $100.

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[flash]

if you have already changed the o-rings once, i am suspecting a problem in the seating surface - there could be a marring of that surface, or even a warping of it - either way, fluid under pressure will escape



also, it could be that it "looks" like it's coming from the o-ring, but really coming from the swaged connector - if these hoses are original, and rubber, they have long since gone past their life expectancy, and there could easily be a leak there where the rubber meets the metal

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[968rz]

I'll try to get under to take a pick of it.

The line is rubber as it runs along the torque tube then turns to steel near the mounting point for the rear swing arm and is steel the rest of the way (about 2 feet).

This in turn fits to an aluminum fitting on the trans, this is where the o-ring seats. I cleaned and inspected the line for cracks/holes and found none.



The seat on the trans side looks smooth as new. When I tried the o-rings I had in the garage it would leak worse but by putting the original back (and new from Porsche) in it leaked about the same as it did before I touched it.

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[flash]

i'm thinking more and more that the line is "sweating" where the rubber meets the metal - it happens

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[968rz]

That's what I was thinking but even after sanding the tube and using a magnifing glass I can find no hole. Plus the fact that changing the o-ring changes the leak make me want to blame the rings; but I ordered more that enough to do 2 complete cars, tried them all and it still leaks. I will try what is suggested but I think I will have to make a new line (at least this end).



I figured this would be a hard one to get help with as very few have tips. I was really hoping this was a common issue but no such luck <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/sad.gif" class="smilie" alt="" />

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[flash]

the two may not be related



using the o-ring that leaks the least, i would wrap the end of the line in tissue paper and pressurize it - that or you could use flour or talcum powder - the leak should show up in a wet spot

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[968rz]

The tube goes through the nut and is crimped to create a hump with a flat that the 0-ring seats on and the nut pushes on, the tube sticks past the o-ring into the fitting about 1".

The nut holds the hump tight against the treads of the next fitting which is machined out to accept the o-ring and create a seat for it (all this looks perfect, no defects). What I did was to add another OE o-ring on the nut side of the hump, it still leaks but not as bad.



Here's a pic.

   

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[oppositelock]

I had the same type of problem in 2000 and it turned out to be a cracked pipe. There was a hairline crack on the nut side of the flare, not the oring side. At that time, the pipes were totaly unavailable from the factory or dealer anywhere in the world. Of course they are unique to 968 tip. Could not find any used ones either. Ended up taking the line out (PITA!). Had a restoration shop cut the line about a foot back, silver solder on a fitting, make an Aeroquip type hose, then custom make a fitting with a flare on one end and the proper trans threads on the other. If I had to do it again, I would SERIOUSLY consider running Aeroquip hose from the trans to the break at the bell housing. It would be much easier to install. Cost me $260 then for the custom work, plus a little more for some heat wrap. Let me know if you have any questions and I'll test my memory or shoot a photo. The metal line must be lined up perfectly and you have vibration working on it. With a flex line you have more freedom to line up the fittings. Mitch

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[968rz]

Thanks for the reply. How did you end up finding the crack? I have looked all over it and can't see one but do suspect that is what's happening.

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[oppositelock]

Rick,



Pulled off the left rear wheel and used lots of light and a mirror and got lucky. I remember thinking I saw a crack and felt it, but could not tell for sure. So I bit the bullet and pulled the line off. There was really no choice because everything else was OK, just like what you are finding. I messed with tweaking the line etc, but nothing worked. Good luck, Mitch

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[968rz]

Thanks Mitch,

Now that the wonderful white stuff is falling <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/angry.gif" class="smilie" alt="" /> I can put the car up not have to put up with the normal withdrawls <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/wacko.gif" class="smilie" alt="" /> . I was trying to think of a way to pressurize the tube to look for a pin hole or something but the vision of ATF spraying out of the trans stopped that dream.

I'll just pull the thing off and bench test it for leaks, good chance to clean the underside <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/rolleyes.gif" class="smilie" alt="" />

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[968rz]

Seeing 968syncros post may me remember to update this thread.
My trans leak did turn out to be the same thing as Mitch (oppositelock).

As a last resort before ordering a new line from the father land I cut the last 12" of line out to reformed the seal end as it looked out of round but it still leaked; so I sealed the ends and filled it with oil then air and sure enough it sprayed out of the crease on the nut side of the flange. It was so small and tight a crack that even knowing where it was you could still not see it, I cleaned it up and brazed in about 1/16th all the way around on the nut side and no more leaks.

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