[Lim Yong]

If the capacity of the Fans increase, that will help with reducing coolant temps also.

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[flash]

are you using tap water?

over 30 years of doing this, and i have NEVER had any corrosion in any of my 40+ cars, or any of my customers cars after i purged their systems

two constants:

1. phosphate free coolant in any aluminum engine

2. distilled water only in all cars

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[xrad]

I thought phosphate free antifreeze was only made for the last 15 years....

Only ever used distilled h20. To each his own.....

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[apex]

cloud9 - I don't plan on any upgrades at this time. I'll be happy to get it cleaned up and back to pristine stock condition. The severed head is in the box and ready to ship out tomorrow.

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[apex]

Ha. I find the anti-freeze topic bewildering so always appreciate a spirited discussion. Maybe I better move to distilled water!

But let's get back to replacing water pump studs. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/happy.gif[/img]

I'm looking at the McMaster-Carr metric stud page and realizing I know next to nothing about what I'm looking for. Who knows:

pitch? length into the block? thread? overall length? strength?

I'd go out and measure off the car, but it's not here, so any help appreciated. Sunset said they'd undertake a search if I needed 'cause even for them it's an obscure item.

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[flash]

xrad - not sure how long phosphate free has been around - always used something specifically designed for aluminum though - not sure what is causing your corrosion then - i've never seen it in any of my cars - seen plenty of deposits left from tap water, but once that was boiled out and the right stuff put in, no recurrence - how often do you flush yours? there must be something different going on that would cause this to be an issue for you and not for me

apex - i have no clue on the waterpump studs - i'd call sunset and just order them if it's an issue - how bad can it be?

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[apex]

<!--quoteo(post=75436:date=Jul 13 2009, 09:32 AM:name=flash)-->QUOTE (flash @ Jul 13 2009, 09:32 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->apex - i have no clue on the waterpump studs - i'd call sunset and just order them if it's an issue - how bad can it be?<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

They're not listed in PET and have no part number. Hence my appeals to the 968 users. I'll figure it out. When I do, I'll post here. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif[/img]

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[flash]

that is very weird - i see the M6 nut, and all of the M6 bolts, but not the stud

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[apex]

Here's something from the Pelican forums, courtesy of The DareDevil on rennlist:

water pump stud thread

relevant info:

<!--quoteo-->QUOTE <!--quotec-->Ok..
there is no part number, it is just a generic stud.
6mmX1.25 (thread pitch) x 47mm in length.
Probably have better luck finding a 45mm
Use care when removing, the 2 on the right protrude into the water jacket.
AFJuvat<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

<!--quoteo-->QUOTE <!--quotec-->To all those looking for the mysterious part # for the 4 water pump studs that are not listed in PET. Note the nut and washers are listed (4) but not the studs.
After following AF's hint of a possible 45 mm generic long stud....
I hunted PET for a 45mm stud. Found one for the 968 oil pump (on a side note I can't believe how many parts are shared between the 944 and the 968!!).
Anyways the 968 uses the M6 x 45
Part #999 062 123 02<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Read the whole thread - we'll need to verify the 45mm will work.

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[xrad]

does the stud have a different pitch/thread on the short end? I found these:

Automotive Fasteners, Inc.
2111 S. Elm-Eugene Street, Greensboro, NC 27406
Toll Free: 800.632.0340 Telephone: 336.274.3731 Fax: 336.273.5081
E-Mail: jimmyr@automotivefasteners.com Web site: www.automotivefasteners.com
Item # 675-319, Metric Studs
Metric Studs
● Dorman Metric stud is Class 8.8 steel and is suitable for most general mounting applications requiring a
metric stud.
● Stud from 675-300 thru 675-359 have Class 3A fit on the short end of the stud. This fit requires a wrench
for installation.
SPECIFICATIONS
Material Class 8.8 Steel
Dimension "A" Thread 6mm - 1.0
Dim. A Length (mm) 20
Dimension "B" Thread 6mm - 1.0 (short block end)
Dim. B Length (mm) 7.5
Overall Length C (mm) 47.5


Just have to change nuts...

Anyone have a pic of the stud?

Ameribolt custom cuts...but that would be expensive

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[apex]

xrad is right on the money. I'm back after some fieldwork.

The studs are indeed 47mm long (1 27/32"). The M6 x 45 oil pump stud as previously mentioned is part number on the current PET 999 062 123 02.

I'll be ordering 4 tomorrow. 45mm is only .08" shorter - should work.

It's probably worth noting that my local porsche guru passed this small test - he came up with the oil pump stud very quickly on his own.

Images:

Weirdly the top stud is 1/8" longer than the others at 1.375" - the others are 1.250" out of the block. Drat - I'll have to go back and see what that's about. I've been burnt before by OCD german engineers specifying bolts a fraction of an inch different lengths right next to each other securing the same piece of hardware.
   
Lowest stud
   
Although that top stud *is* 47mm overall...
   
Through the block - first of two - left side
   
Through the block - two of two - right side
   

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[apex]

A quick note to report that Pete is done with the head repair - on it's way back home. Only two exhaust valves were bent. All eight exhaust guides were replaced. Everything else was in good shape.

Nice.

Lots of my other parts are two weeks out. It will be good to have the top half my engine back on Monday. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif[/img]

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[xrad]

looking at the pics above, looks like mostly corrosion buildup BETWEEN threads, may be able to bronze brush it off and recoat the studs with rust inhibitor. They may still be in good shape. I would change the nuts to stainless.

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[apex]

Well all my parts are in - ha - after spending my life savings all I get is a picnic table full of nuts and bolts? [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif[/img]

I need some help with sourcing a part - then I'll post some pics of the cleaned up head.

Sunset is going to bring the full force of their parts department detectives on the problem tomorrow - but at the moment they're flummoxed. I'll call Pete at RS Barn as well - who by the way is turning out to be *the* go-to guy with questions regarding this project. When you see my cleaned-up head I hope you'll agree.

   

We're looking for part number 45 from the PET. Part 928 105 262 00. The rubber seal at the back of the bearing cap that seals up camshaft bearing. If you order this part number you get the steel pin, but not the round rubber seal.

Anyone know the part number of the rubber seal?

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[apex]

   
   
   
   
   
   

   
   
   
   
   
   
   

ahhh... the parts table

   

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[Cloud9...68]

Ouch - those are some scary-looking divots in your head surface. I hate to ask, but is that even fixable? I assume it must be, but how?

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[apex]

Ha - I know - scary, ugly, whatever. All the experts tell me they are not a problem - as long as they don't touch or intrude into the head gasket seal. Corrosion where the head touches the water jacket is not uncommon. You can't really mill them off - too deep. Serious cases can be repaired by welding prior to resurfacing. In my case the head was perfectly true and flat and only needed five thou taken off - plus a little bead blasting and cleanup.

Oh. And new valves and guides of course.

Re - the plug at the back of the head: what I've heard so far is the early cars have the pin and the plug, later cars dispense with the plug and only retain the pin. According to my sources at the RS Barn.

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[xrad]

Likely corrosion or casting pits, don;t worry about them if outside compression ring and coolant gasket. Be careful on reassembly. If you add extra sealant to gaskets like h20 pump, some of these on the shelf at local auto store will cause aluminum corrosion.

Yes, they can be fixed by welding and grinding, but takes a skilled repair person, and pricey..

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[firefish]

A little caution is advised regarding mixing stainless with plain steel and aluminum. Especially stainless and aluminum can be a very bad combo depending on the conditions and may result in severly increased corrosion of the aluminum. This is even more likely in wet areas like cooling system et.c. I have seen 1,5 mm airplane quality aluminum being eaten through by corrosion in fourteen days (this was in on airplane floats in sweet water and submerged) where the owner had replaced a steel screw with a stainless one. This may or may not be an issue in an engine but it is food for thought.

And it may prove difficult to find the correct grade stainless compared to steel.

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[flash]

yup - when i was designing for DOD we could not put stainless and aluminum together without some fairly serious and expensive precautions

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