[Rap]

Is there something to read on momentum driving or do I just glean it from what you just wrote

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[flash]

google away. i'm sure it's out there.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[Cloud9...68]

[quote name='Rap' timestamp='1345682330' post='131444']

Is there something to read on momentum driving or do I just glean it from what you just wrote

[/quote]

As the great Fangio once responded to a reporter's inquiry as to the secret of his success, "Less brake, more gas"



Seriously, the concept of keeping the momentum up in this car was a real eye-opener for me. I was unbelievably, pathetically slow through my first three DE weekends. Having horrible instructors didn't help. It wasn't until the second day of my fourth event that I got an instructor who pointed out how much I was over-braking, killing the car's momentum through the turns. Keep in mind that your number one goal needs to be maximizing your exit speed, particularly on the corner leading to the longest straight.

Analogous to Flash's exercise of trying to keep off the brakes altogether, I like to imagine that the track is covered with soapy water. What would it take to get around the track the fastest under these conditions? The smoothest possible inputs to the steering, accelerator, and, most importantly, the brakes. Jackie Stewart used to imagine there was a dainty old granny in the back of his race car, and his goal was to jostle her around as little as possible. All different ways of saying the same thing - be as smooth as possible, and keep as much speed as possible through the turns, particularly at the exit. Also, please note that this business of minimizing the use of the brakes is much more applicable on tight, technical tracks. If you drive on tracks with some long straights, obviously you need to get on the brakes very hard. But even here, smoothness is the key. Easier said than done, though.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[flash]

the best drivers i ever saw were guys who came from rainy areas. they have to be smooth or they end up in the hay bales.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[Langley968]

[quote name='flash' timestamp='1345686205' post='131451']

the best drivers i ever saw were guys who came from rainy areas. they have to be smooth or they end up in the hay bales.

[/quote]



Aryton Senna was astounding in the rain. Most can race on a nice dry clean track, the rain separates the "boys from the men"....

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[986boxster1998]

Rap,



The M030 has 160,000 on it; new clutch with only about 2,000 miles on it. Car's interior and exterior look like they have half that many miles, some blemishes though.



Thanks, Dan

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[Eric_K]

[quote name='Cloud9...68' timestamp='1345685606' post='131448']

Jackie Stewart used to.....

[/quote]



Jackie Stewart describing smooth:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OgSiK_VarK8

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[flash]

yes!!!!



i love that clip. it says exactly what i have been trying to say all along.



of course, you will never get a pca driving instructor to teach you that. 2 reasons.



1. it's very hard to teach, and requires a real feel on the the part of the driver.



2. it's a lot more dangerous to learn to do.



i got lucky 30 years ago and found a teacher that was willing to teach me that way, instead of the traditional way. liability and heavy traffic won't really let anybody do that anymore. instead, you get the brake hard, turn, step on gas method.



i love the last line. the fastest way is the slowest way. that's perfect. you aren't going into the turn as fast as you might, but you're coming out faster.



beautiful

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[Cloud9...68]

Yes, that's outstanding - beautifully articulated. My DE instructors always told me to come down HARD on the brakes (always in a straight line!), turn, and then back suddenly on the gas after the apex (like Flash describes above). Very unsettling to the car. Driveway Austin introduced me to trail braking (30 years after the 3-day Bondurant course I took at Sears Point taught me the same thing). This was a revelation, because this changed the cornering process in my mind from an abrupt on/off/on process, to a much more fluid, almost seamless transition connecting a pair of straights. It seems to work very well with a momentum car like the 968, because there's never a big "speed hole" caused by an abrupt braking application to have to crawl back out of. Once I figured this out, my lap times started dropping at an almost dizzying pace.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[Rap]

Wow, Bertil Roos and two DE's taught me hard braking on a straight line. I did that and that is what caused me to spin and hit the wall. Bob my instructor taught me trail braking after that and the balance of the weekend I went into the first corner faster than when I spun. Granted I have much more to learn. But that clip is absolutely fantastic. Well explained! Thanks Eric!

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[KRAG50]

[attachment=12131:Grattan Audi Club 086 (Small).jpg



]If you get a chance, do a few DE's in the rain, don't pass them up. It really teaches you smoothness a feel for the road. Here in Michigan I've done several, and made more progress than five normal DE's.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[Cloud9...68]

Yes, the owner of a company that puts on DEs here in Texas once half-jokingly told us that he feels like he should charge extra on rainy days because of how much the participants learn from the experience. Intentionally doing a track event in the rain is very good advice.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[Rap]

Yes it's called key man insurance. Have it. I'm he successe. Perhaps I was unclear. During conversation with a pretty intelligent guy he made a comment that caught my attention. I am under no pressure or focus at work due to driving. I thought that we have such a varied membership that it was not only an interesting question to pose but one that others might have dealt with or have knowledge of.

Now you tell me. The third day at the Glen it poured and I opted not to drive in it. Seemed prudent at the time especially with the first days spin still fresh in my mind. Next time however!

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[JWahlsten]

Interesting turn this conversation has taken... I'm not in any way shape or form in some sort of corporation, I'm DoD, and we spend money you guys make.



I decided against taking the option to drive in the rain this week because I didn't want the increased risk of driving on a track with standing water on track tires. Unfortunately, the storm was a pop up and wasn't forecasted, so putting on the street tires prior to the session wasn't an option. Besides, it was pouring rain. I watched a 993, albeit an inexperienced driver, try to pass and pirouette his way down the front straight. Long story short, there is much to be learned in the rain, but safety of person and car has to be considered as well. For me it was last run session of the 2 day event, and the risk to reward matrix seemed out of balance... Do I normally go out in the rain, yes. Is there a lot to be learned about smoothness, sure, but you have to consider the tires you're on for certain.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[Rap]

I suppose it is like any cherry. One needs to get that first rain run in to understand the dynamics of running in the rain and become comfortable with it. My choice not to run was on the third day first run and while I would have enjoyed another couple of dry runs, I had already run a full two days.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[Rap]

So tomorrow I go and pick up a 93 red coupe with <acronym title='Limited Slip Differential'>LSD</acronym>. It then is being driven over to Max at Provost. For those of you who might question the need for a <acronym title='pre purchase inspection'>PPI</acronym>, think again! Not only did I miss a lot of things that perhaps I should have seen, but Max picked up a lot that I wouldn't have. One of those was the <acronym title='Limited Slip Differential'>LSD</acronym> which even the owner was unaware of. $250 well spent. The many other items found were factored into not only the price but the rest of the things that need to be attended to.

Thanks for all of you who chimed in with your thoughts and advice. It certainly allowed me to frame the issue so as to make a good decision. Good enough I might add to have been comfortable walking away without regrets had a mutually agreed upon price had not been reached.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[rl968]

So we'll see you on the 14th @ lightning w/schattenbaum?



Max is good, well Worth the $250.

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[tamathumper]

Wow! Congrats. <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/biggrin.png" class="smilie" alt="" />

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[Rap]

Rl boy I wish. There is a laundry list of things to do including installing some design 1 products. Plus that's a weekend I come back from a family vacation. Right about Max. He worked on my car before I purchased it and after. So now it's just prioritizing a list and finishing it. Before I run out of money!

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.

[Rap]

Thanks Tama!

Partial Post: Please Login or Register to read the full post.