[lbpesq]

Kaiser did a long term study where they followed tobacco only smokers, cannabis only smokers, and those who smoked both. As expected, the lung cancer rates for tobacco only smokers was increased as compared to non-smokers. More interesting is that the cannabis only smokers did not show an increase of lung cancer over non-smokers. Surprisingly, the tobacco/cannabis smokes showed a lower incidence of lung cancer than tobacco only smokers. The cannabis appeared to have a prophylactic effect against lung cancer.



A long term study of Jamaican cannabis users also found no increase in incidence of lung cancer.



Many more recent studies have found cannabis to have anti-cancer properties. Of course these studies have been done in other countries, notably Australia and Israel, as the U.S. government only allows studies whose proposed purpose is to prove that cannabis is bad. If a study is proposed to look for good attributes of cannabis, or even to approach the research with an open mind, NIDA and the DEA won't allow the study.



At this point, I think it might be best to put this discussion to bed, though I won't object to letting another have the last word. This is a friendly car forum and I think we are fast approaching the edge of the envelope here. I leave this discussion with the observation that, at least in the context of this discussion, science doesn't change opinions and opinions don't change science.

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[Monstrous4Banger]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJmQ16cGBHU

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[flash]

the issue is not the cannabis component when related to cancer. it's the smoke and what it contains. there are plenty of studies out there to show the increased rate of cancer in lab animals (which is how any compound is tested).



in pill form, this would not be an issue. as it is a drug, and just like any other drug, that is how it should be distributed, regulated, and medicinally used.

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[lbpesq]

Flash:



The studies involved human beings smoking cannabis. Not U.S. government studies where they expose a rat to 10,000 times the human dose and, if the rat twitches, proclaim "that proves marijuana is bad". When I see that all the gov't propaganda has resulted in you, who I consider to be a very intelligent person, ignoring the science, I know I have my work cut out for me.



As for "pills", you are incorrect that that is how every drug is administered. Aside form the obvious injection administration, many drugs are administered through the lungs, including asthma inhalers, steroids, and other inhalation therapies. Ever hear of Dr. Shiffman's Asthmador Cigarettes? Other methods of administration include sub-lingual (absorbed under the tongue), absorbed through the skin, and suppositories, to name the ones that initially come to mind.

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[94SilverCab]

I can never keep those pills lit anyway Ba-dum-bum...

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[flash]

it should undergo the same testing and pass the same standards as any other drug, whatever that may be. i am not the one setting the standards. you can find the cancer incident results very easily with a quick search. the smoke causes cancer at a much higher rate than tobacco smoke at the same doses.



i did not say that every drug was administered by pill. i said that in pill form the issue of cancer from the smoke would not be an issue, and that as a drug, it should be distributed, regulated and medicinally used. two separate points. lol - maybe you were stoned and misread that, and combined the two separate sentences and points?

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[94SilverCab]

Meh, the last thing I would want is pot from a laboratory...I'd prefer a winery type model (not to say that wineries don't employ highly scientific method) where the nuance of of the terrior and the hand of the grower would be expressed rather than some dumbed down pablum. If you want to include labeling regarding THC content, that would be ok with me (as in, proof or % alcochol).



MHO,



Jay

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[flash]

in pill form, it would be identical, as it is only the active chemical is being extracted. only in plant consumption form are the nuances present.



again though, medicinal and not entertainment use is the point. any drug can be abused for entertainment purposes, and most are. that doesn't make it right, smart, or desirable. i've been as guilty of using something for entertainment purposes as the next guy, and i got lucky, but i still know it was stupid. it diminished me at the time, and is something i never should have done, though having done it and gotten past it, and seen what it has done to other lives, i can appreciate my good fortune all that much more, and hope that the wisdom gained from that will continue to prevail.

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[968Syncro]

Marijuana extract of some sort is currently available in your neighborhood pharmacy by prescription, and has been for some time. It is used for people who are underweight. --- A couple of years ago when California had a pot legalization proposition, I joked with the staff at the CVS pharmacy about what varieties they will have available. They answered quite seriously that they currently have bottles of pills in the back and are prescribed for people who need to eat more.

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[flash]

then i see no reason for further legislation if we already have a legal product on the market. all they need to do is expand the usage to suit other medical needs, (i.e. cancer treatment).

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[Rap]

While we all seem to have strong opinions here, we should continue to respect those voiced regardless which side of the equation they come from. It's interesting how the conversation seems to have devolved into whether pot is bad or good for you. Whether it is or isn't, my belief, observed everyday is that pot seems to be a drug that people graduate from to more serious ones. That's not to say that some don't graduate or all do. It gets back to the implied acceptance of a behavior, pot smoking, that encourages people to try different drugs. Young people are susceptible to these behavioral encouragements for decisions even beyond pot smoking. For example, driving a car under some influence because their friends do or because of a social pressure. Bill, I suspect you did, I know I did. Andy we need to test you to find out where you came from! Perhaps you came from the Midwest like Flash!!! Legalization will not only affect but encourage behavior that condones the use of drugs. Legal or illegal. Now as a society if we accept that as a consequence that is acceptable to the voting public, then the issue can be solved. I go back to the need for a national and rational discussion of the use of drugs in society, the pro' s and

cons and the consequences of behavior resulting from this decision and the solution for dealing with it.

Dealing with the entire issue as opposed to dealing with it on a piece mail basis has a chance of providing a path to a decision.

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[flash]

you would know. you are in a very unique and informed position to know the patterns, free of the politics and propaganda.



point of correction, i come from california born and raised. my parents' parents came from the midwest. they were very influential on my upbringing though, whether it was things i came to despise and ridicule, or things i came to adopt and appreciate.

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[Rap]

My mistake, I apologize. Although you seem so midwesternish!!! Lol grandparents see, to have that influence no doubt. I see things in myself that remind me of my grandfather, good and bad. Genes, environment and learned behavior. There's that word behavior again!

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[Cloud9...68]

"Andy we need to test you to find out where you came from!"



Rap,



I'm a freak of nature - grew up in the Bay Area in the 60's and 70's, graduated from the UC Berkeley - yes, the Peoples' Republic of Berkeley - and never developed the slightest interest in any type of hallucinogenic drug. I hate the feeling of being the least bit out of control, even something as benign as being slightly drowsy. The appeal of getting loopy on drugs or alcohol is one of those things (along with the popularity of the Kardashians, people believing the world is going to end next month or that 911 was an "inside job", and the college football bowl system) that makes ZERO sense to me. Puts me in a very different 1% category, I guess...

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[Rap]

Sort of beyond belief. Where you in a seminary or over in Tibet being a monk? Lol. Interestingly enough your not alone. Ain't a lot of you around but it speaks wonders about the courage of ones convictions. This is a form of behavior unfortunately that people all too frequently use when verbalizing that addicts don't have to use. The either don't have to start in the first place or can stop after one has started. By the way some folds have raved about the brace!

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[lbpesq]

The drug available by prescription that Roland references is Dranabinol, and sold under the trade name Marinol. It is not a plant extract. It is synthetic THC in a sesame oil base in a gel cap. It does not contain any natural extracts, nor does it contain any other of the cannabinoids found in natural cannabis, such as CBD and CBN, which appear to greatly enhance the medicinal effects of THC. Marinol is VERY expensive. It is hard to judge the appropriare dosage as it does not take effect until 45 min. - 1.5 hours after ingestion. When cannabis is inhaled, the effects are felt literally within a minute or two. Thus it is far easier to gauge proper dosage and patients get immediate relief. This is especially important to patients suffering from nausea or pain. Furthermore, when used for the wasting syndrome associated with AIDS, it is often difficult for the patient to keep from throwing up the pill. Most patients report that they far prefer natural cannabis.

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[ds968]

Never had the slightest interest in trying any drugs, so never did...count me among those three people of our generation who fit in that category, lol. However, I started drinking wine when I was about 12 years old , IIRC, ( very common practice where I grew up for parents to allow children a bit of wine with dinner ) and I do enjoy my alcohol to this very day. I consume it often, but it never consumes me. Back to pot : I have two close friends who smoke it, one of whom I would definitely categorize as an addict and although I keep hearing that pot is not addictive, observing his behavior I would argue against that ; his mind is continuously preoccupied with the thought of the next opportunity to smoke a joint, it is an absolute need for him to light one up from the moment he wakes up and then every couple of hours during the day until he goes to sleep. He smokes cigarettes as well, drinks quite a bit of wine, yet he is not nearly as obsessed with those as he seems to be with weed. That said, he manages to function quite well and I' ve never seen him " impaired " no matter how much he smokes. Anyway, like many here, I

have no objections to anyone's rights to do whatever they please, as long as it does not interfere with

anyone else's right to a safe and enjoyable surrounding. And that applies not just to drugs, but pretty

much everything else provided you don't compromise other individuals well being in the process. If you hurt someone however, or violate their liberties in any way you must suffer the consequences of your actions. That needs to be ingrained in the mind of every child as they grow up and society must have the discipline to strictly observe and enforce those rules.

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[ds968]

On second thought maybe I should try some pot, it might make me sleep instead of posting on tne forum at 2 :20 AM , lol.

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[Rap]

There are those who drink until they pass out! When you say functional, against what baseline? Perhaps with this man you don't really know his functional curve because you've never seen him not under the influence. I once worked with a great guy who clearly was an alcoholic. Nice demeanor and professional at work except for his red face and air of alcohol that emanated from him, yet I always wondered what he would be like sober. This of course was long before my current capacity. As with many functioning users, behind the scene there is much more going on that is not present in everyday life. Perhaps DS as you get older you need less sleep! Lol

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[ds968]

I've known this guy for about 25 years, he only started weed little over five years ago when his wife passed away from ovarian cancer ( she was smoking to treat / manage the illness , he got into weed shortly before her death and continued ever since..) I have often worked with him for these 25 years and stil do very frequently in addition to spending much time together in social settings. Our families have also spent many entire weekends traveling, or, at eachother's homes, etc, etc.. so I have observed his " functionality " years before his weed days, and years after , in almost every setting and circumstances and for extended periods of time so I am fairly confident in my assertion that his smoking does not appear to me to render him impaired in any way vs. those old days when he did not use weed, at least as far as my memory serves me.. But I recognize that everyone reacts differently to stimullants , so I don't dismiss the possibility that many other people may be impaired by weed, just as many are by alcohol. But admittedly I did jump to a quick conclusion based on solely one sample because his personality and cognitive skills / functionality certianly changes with wine but does not when he smokes weed so I figured that weed in general must be the far lesser evil of the two substances...and thus, legalized !

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