[968forums]

while most of the members are not a concern, and we thank them for that, but we have an ongoing problem with some people starting threads in the wrong places - either they haven't taken the time to learn where everything is, or they are just too plain lazy to do it - either way, it is a problem that then requires that somebody go in and move them - meanwhile, the countless people who do more than just hit "view new posts" miss out on what is being said about something they may be interested in or able to help with



please please please put threads where they belong when you start them - we don't get the chance to see every one of them, and it sometimes takes a couple of weeks to find a thread that is in the wrong place and then move it to where it belongs - it is also a time consuming process that just should not have to be done, and it takes away from the time we could be helping somebody - we are trying to keep this board organized, and not let it become the useless pile of repetitive threads that other sites have become



we understand that there are a LOT of categories and areas here - that can seem a bit daunting at first - please take the time to browse around - don't just hit "view new posts" - you'll find a lot of information that won't show up there - you'll also find out that it is very easy to find things when it is organized like this



do yourself and us a favor, read the tutorial - it will help a LOT - click on different categories - get familiar with how things are lain out - it will help us all



if you don't know where to start a thread, or are having a problem, please send an email or a pm and ASK! - also, while not a place to start threads not about this site, this entire category is for asking questions about that kind of thing too - please don't just dump it in some area thinking "they'll take care of it" - please do not hesitate to ask questions - we are here to help, and to teach, but we really don't want to waste time and resource cleaning up after people



every category exists for a reason, and as time goes on, they will make a lot more sense - as an example, "triage and diagnosing" is not a place to ask all sorts of questions - it is exactly what it says it is - it is a place to go to figure out what is causing what, and point you in a direction - it is not a place to get specs, get a repair, find a shop, or discuss in detail anything not diagnostic in origin - just like at a hospital, you go there first when you don't know what the heck is going on - then you go to the "specialist" category to fix your problem



if this problem continues, and we see a pattern, the moderator will contact the individual responsible and let them know it needs to be corrected - if it still continues, further steps will have to be taken - their threads may just get deleted or their privileges to start threads could be suspended so that time can be spent with that individual and they can be taught where things go



we have an incredible resource here, and an unparalleled opportunity to preserve things for posterity, but it will only continue to be useful as long as the members are able to easily share information, access it, and it stays organized - please help us to do that by spending the time to put things where they belong

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[rhudeboye]

[quote name='968forums' post='60602' date='Sep 26 2008, 07:47 AM']we understand that there are a LOT of categories and areas here - that can seem a bit daunting at first -

every category exists for a reason, and as time goes on, they will make a lot more sense[/quote]



Whats the difference between the wax on wax off section and the showroom section?

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[flash]

as the description of the category says, "wax on wax off" is specifically for detailing stuff, primarily for product evaluation, product recommendations, and tips on how to do stuff - it is not a spot to say "look how cool my car looks after a detailing"



"showroom" is the place to show off your car

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[rhudeboye]

I asked because I was searching for a thread that dealt with the wax & polish job done on the car. So I searched in the wax section but it was in showroom. But I guess that's your point. This thread however was started as a show off though, as the owner didn't do the work himself. Ahhh, just one of those rare occurrences I guess.

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[flash]

lol - it happens



that is exactly why i had to create so many categories - threads would start off on one thing, and go to another - everybody, including myself, tends to wander in conversation - such is the nature of the beast



we'll be paying more and more attention, and redirecting threads and discussions, so that they stay on topic more - there is no way we are going to be able to do it all, but i think we should be able to keep things focused a bit more and make the database more useful - we already have more content here than all of the other sites combined - that demands some organization and diligence so that we don't become a jumbled pile of repetitive threads



we have no issue whatsoever with people starting how ever many threads they want, and in fact encourage it - we just want to try to keep each thread topic specific - that way, things like your search you just did, will be a no brainer

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[Darryl]

[quote name='flash' post='61007' date='Oct 2 2008, 11:25 AM']that is exactly why i had to create so many categories - threads would start off on one thing, and go to another - everybody, including myself, tends to wander in conversation - such is the nature of the beast[/quote]



I think that's one of the biggest challenges/problems with forums in general. I know I find this to be a problem on lots of other forums. Just when you think you've found a thread that deals with what you're looking for, it gets so far off topic that it doesn't ever answer your question or get to the point. The only way to curtail that is to be a real stickler for jumping in and moderating and that's what great about this borad, is that's not done very often. So, very much a double edged sword...we all appreciate the moderating efforts and I believe your point of starting threads in the right place is to allow us to police ourselves and we all need to recognize when the conversation gets too far off topic, it's probably time to start a new thread...in the right place, of course!



At any rate, keep up the good work.



- Darryl

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[flash]

thanks - yes, it is very difficult trying to decide when to step in and when not to - hopefully, as more people become more familiar with the different categories, it will be easier, and hopefully people will indeed police themselves, or make a comment to somebody else who might be taking things off track - it's easy to start a new thread and continue the conversation there



p.s. - we are considering taking on new moderators to help with this

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[biotechee]

Don't be looking for me to volunteer... I stay on topic like a pat of butter on top of a hot tortoise shell!

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[Anchorman]

Speaking of staying on topic - Bio, I'll be at Pete's this coming Tuesday.



Now back to our normally-scheduled topic.

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[94SilverCab]

I volunteer to send Flash 10 lbs. of decaf....



Thank you, thank you very much...



Jay

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[mikeo]

OK. I'll be the contrarian. I never use the categories. For my once or twice daily dose of Forums I look at all of the new posts. For research, I use search. Back in the days of paper I had extensively categorized files. It was the only way I could find what I wanted in a hurry. But now I am an old dog that's learned a new trick!



I believe that some folks don't want to spend the time to find the "right" category because there are too many categories.



Going to the bunker now <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/tongue.gif" class="smilie" alt="" />

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[flash]

lol - no bunker required



well, that's fair, except for the part where it doesn't work, and the part where you are missing out on a lot of great information - here has long been a list of people who have cried about the loss of .net and its "incredible archive" - we are determined not to let that happen - those same people though also complained that the search engine there was all but useless - that was largely because of the lack of structure



the new posts button does not show everything, and never will - the search engine doesn't turn up everything either, so manual searching is required - people need to spend more time going to the library and learning or re-learning how to actually do research - the internet is NOT the best way to do that - it gives a lot of quick answers, but not the whole story, and has created a bunch of lazy, ill-mannered, poorly read people who have forgotten half the fun of belonging to a community like this



(can you tell i've been watching the debate? nu-cu-lar???)



as for the laziness issue and new threads, if the gentle prodding doesn't work with those folks who don't want to spend the time, and the problem persists, we will be at the point of putting new threads on an approval basis, or worse, just deleting those threads that are in the wrong place - nobody wants that to happen, but it is taking too much time sorting them, and i will not have them in the wrong place - that doesn't serve anybody - this site will not become another useless pile of repetitive threads like all of the other sites, nor will it become a full time job for us - self policing is required, and i expect at least the members to respect the wishes, even if they don't recognize the obvious benefits, and to act accordingly



it's all part of being a community - this is not a world of one

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[biotechee]

My only complaint is that I believe it is now too specialized. I think some sections could really be narrowed down, but that is my opinion.



Also, I agree that some amount of self moderation and "sticking to the rules" is required, but part of the fun of being in a community that is now so email-based is the back and forth banter. I know I have a tendancy to interject humor more than technical information, but that's simply my nature (or lack of brains, take your pick). Fine line to walk for sure.



My concluding suggestion is to be careful just how much moderation and "compartmentalization" is displayed. We are unique individuals and I know that some individuals may not appreciate the true root of all the efforts you guys are putting forth.... Nonetheless, try to avoid a martial law site. <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/laugh.gif" class="smilie" alt="" />



Either way, I appreciate what you guys are doing, no doubt. And I am thankful this site exists!



Jim

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[flash]

there is a time and place for chit chat - that's why we opened the chat room - many people want to have conversations within threads (i've certainly done it), but that is often counter-productive to an information database - so we created a venue for both - it isn't working like we hoped, but i have some ideas on how to make that happen



as a resource though, topics need to stay focused, or we might as well just delete everything on a periodic basis - interjecting humor and such is great - no issues with that of course - however, a decision had to be made as to the primary purpose of the site - that is to archive all things 968, and provide a resource for owners to connect to other owners, and seek information they need about their cars - it's job is not primarily a social club - it's great that such an element filters into everything, but that doesn't change the primary goals and functions



ultimately, information will be edited down, distilled and archived into library format, and old threads likely closed - the objective will be to provide a way for someone to merely look up what they want, as if in an encyclopedia - the social portion would be separate entirely



much more active moderation will facilitate these things - without it though this site will become as useless as the others

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[biotechee]

I would have to suggest that the current level of moderation is suitable. There are no flame wars, no outwardly derrogatory posts that I have seen, etc. Most things end up where they are supposed to, or at least close by... And yes, many threads go off track, but I believe the vast majority of us understand what that can do and we do try to engage in some level of self moderation. Does it always work, no? Does it need to always work, no again.



Asking a few more individuals to help with "directing" where threads go and keeping an eye out for violations of the charter is good. Closing threads because they "might" become heated when they clearly aren't is not.



Frankly, given my schedule and lifestyle, chat rooms serve no use. Never will. I don't want a scheduled time to be live online. I don't want a phone IM. I don't want text messages. If I need immediate interaction regarding the 968, I've got a telephone, a cell phone and various individuals' phone numbers. Guess I am not 100% on board with technology these days.... In greater than 99.9999% of the time, my 968 fix can simply occur if and when it does. I actually like opening 968Forums first thing in the morning to see what happened whilst I was counting sheep.



I think this forum (and .net before it) is a place where people can connect, it should be more than just be a repository for all things 968. It, in my opinion, should be a place where 968 owners, enthusiasts, and admirers come to learn about the car, share their experiences about the car, make new connections with others of similar interests, and feel welcome to engage in such activities. I am not sure how to go about balancing the desire to have the best reference resource available for the 968 with the undeniable need for more of a "community". Perhaps that balance doesn't exist, but if we do not try to find it, that's when it will end up like the other sites.

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[flash]

i agree with all of the points - it is very hard for me to wear both hats (member and moderator) - it never turns out well, and always looks like i am throwing a fit or a tantrum whenever i close something or change something - if i had emotions, that may valid - but those got shut down a long time ago and is a topic for a discussion with a shrink, but does not play into any decisions i make here - if it did, i would have taken much stronger actions a long time ago in a few situations



i HATE closing threads - but sometimes it becomes necessary when a conversation that SHOULD BE TAKEN OFFLINE isn't, and the thread becomes pointless banter or an argument, neither of which are useful or helpful - i just did that yesterday, and hope to reopen that thread with new information from somebody, anybody, but frankly that entire exchange should have happened offline, or better yet on the phone - it served no purpose, was going nowhere, and as much fun as it was to ponder and theorize, was exactly the kind of thing that does not belong on the board - i probably should have just deleted the thread, but i hate that even more - i am just as guilty as anyone of letting threads go off track, and getting into a one on one exchange that is off topic - i don't do enough policing of myself either



incidentally, such a phone conversation is what is going to happen later today



as for the chat room - i'm not sure what is going to work just yet, but i certainly don't want to see 2000 threads about chips just because somebody didn't do the homework - repetitive threads are not in the best interests of the site, and many questions could be handled with a quick response - many people are too impatient or too lazy to look for something, and consequently post a new thread about the same thing - i can't believe how many threads there are about "will boxster wheels fit on my car?" - a chat room or live help would resolve this - the problem is the dedication of time



i also refuse to "text" and hate IMs - heck i barely use a cell phone - so i am just as much of the problem as anything - maybe i need to create an area of which the content disappears after a fixed period of time - i don't know - all i know is that this will become a useless pile if we don't stay on top of it



so now, how do we keep the threads from becoming cluttered with off topic nonsense without stifling the members?

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