[nibn968]

after reading through this topic and on other sites as well I decided to have my driver and passenger airbags disconnected but not completely removed from the car (airbags are stil present but disconnected).



My mechanic unplugged the airbag system. And instead of removing the airbag light bulb he installed a bridge adapter I got from ECS Tuning.



Just to verify.....This has effectively rendered the ballistics inert and neither the driver or passenger airbags would spontaneously go off since there is no electricity going through?



In the future if I decide sell the car, this should be reversible where the bridge connector would be removed and the airbag system reconnected?

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[williamoss]

I understand all of your points, well taken. But if a part has a lifetime warranty, what is actual lifetime? Is it 10 years 15 years 20 years or forever? And what if other cars with similar airbags have had failures. Then it is the part at fault not the vehicle that it is in?

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[flash]

there is no real hard and fast standard for the term "lifetime".



the "accepted" industry standard for a car and/or its "lifetime" parts is 120k miles, or 10 years. manufacturers generally design things to fit that. some parts may last well beyond that.

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[paulzebo]

Where are you getting the airbag has a lifetime warranty? The statement is that it should be good for the life of the vehicle, and does not require routine replacement. That statement no way extends a "lifetime warranty"



Porsche warranty period from Porsche USA



The warranty periods begin on the day of delivery to the customer. The following periods apply:



4 year / 50,000 mls (80,000 km) warranty for all new vehicles whichever occurs first*;



*Applies for vehicles purchased and registered in the USA and Canada (outside the USA and Canada 2 years / unlimited miles).

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[williamoss]

well if they say the airbag is good for the life of the vehicle, then is it not the same thing as saying it has a lifetime guaranty, because if it fails during the life of the vehicle even if the vehicle is 20 years old,



then it was not good for the life of the vehicle.

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[flash]

no, it is not the same thing.



again, the accepted industry standard for the life expectancy of the vehicle (or any vehicle) is only meant to be 10 years.

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[Ernie]

Nibn968, do you have a part number for the bridge, should anyone else choose to go that route?

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[flash]

it's as simple as a 3 ohm resistor plugged into the connector.

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[ds968]

Shocking as it may seem, there are no laws or similar rules and regulations which can be enforced , in any industry, strictly defining what either "lifetime" or "life of the product" warranty means and to what it exactly translates in terms of years or mileage. There is case law here and there in various states which may be cited in consumer claims against anyone issuing a so called lifetime warranty, but since any given consumer's expectation of that definition is completely irrelenvant and since the FTC has not set any parameters for what a lifetime / product life terms are, you're subject to whatever the particular court's interpretation and judgment is, on a case by case basis. And even the 10 year " standard " flash mentioned which many manufacturers generally go by , is nothing more than a commonly accepted expectation more so than it is a standard because it's also not enforceable, either against a manufacturer or a against a warranty company.



well, maybe with the exception of Cuba where the average " lifetime of a car " standard and expectation is 60 years , -) :-)

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[flash]

yup - that's why i kept putting it in quotation marks, and referencing it as "accepted" and such.



sorry guys - we're all screwed here. since they stopped making those bags a long time ago, unless they start up again, your best bet is to retrofit something else. this would not be all that hard. it would actually be very easy on the driver side, by merely installing a different steering wheel. then you could also get the benefits of a type 2 bag.

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[ds968]

Do these Porsche OE steering wheels have type 2 bags and is it easy to retrofit one in the 968 ?

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[flash]

pretty sure they do. i'm looking into it. that's likely the wheel i would put in the white car.



not easy, but it can be done. basically the hub is too thick and needs to be machined down a bit. not hard, but you need the right tool.

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[schwarz968]

Even so, isn't replacing the wheel with a more recent model just delaying the same outcome...obsolecesence, warranty etc? Impact on insurability and liability for tampering with the original design approval etc?

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[flash]

there should be no impact on insurability, as the newer bag would be safer, but your insurance company may vary on that.



yes, obsolescence is an issue. it would be that way on any car though eventually

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[WJH]

Is the concern that the bag will not deploy in a wreck? Or, is the concern that the bag will deploy without a wreck?

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[ds968]

[quote name='WJH' timestamp='1408945603' post='161535']Is the concern that the bag will not deploy in a wreck? Or, is the concern that the bag will deploy without a wreck?[/quote]



Yes.





:-) :-) . I think there is a possibility for both, given the age of the bag mechanism . But I'm assuming it's a very small possibility at that...maybe negligible, but statistic probabilities mean nothing to the person to whom it happens..

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[ds968]

from my friend's neighbor ( who has a relatively new Cayman ) :



Subject: Product Liability / Lemon Law

Hi guys, this is an ALERT --- FYI --- HELP. Yesterday, Sept. 17, 2014, I had the three airbags deploy while at standstill in my new Cayman Porsche. Scared the s*** out of me, but other than that I was uninjured, just pissed as hell. I am sure the adrenaline was following, so I was not the sharpest tack in the bag at that time. My baby is only 4 1/2 months old and has 4,700 miles on the OD. Now the details and questions.

SCENARIO

I had driven the Porsche up to Camarillo for an appointment on my parents estate issues. I got there early so I decided to visit my cousin, John. I spent about 45 minutes with him. I had parked the Porsche on the street with no cars in front, or the back, of me. I got back in the car and prepared to leave. I turned the ignition key on and immediately I noticed the alarm notice one of the dash instruments - STOP/START DISENGAGE AIRBAG. Then about 2 or 3 seconds later the passenger airbag exploded. Talk about a loud noise and utter destruction. The windshield had a mushroom dome on that side, fine glass scattered on passenger side of car. I turned the ignition off, said a few choice word and was pissed as hell. I could see out of the driver's side fine and I had my appointment to go to, so I turned the ignition on a second time and again within 5 seconds of contact the two airbags on the driver's side exploded. Now I was really pissed. Again I was not injured, except for scraps on my shins from the under the dash bag. Smoke and an awful smell enveloped the cabin area. My psyche was ruffled a bit and my adrenaline flowing even more. No more incidents occurred. I was sure the door side bags would go off next, but not the case.

AFTERMATH - Day 1

After my appointment I called Rusnak Pasadena, my dealer, to tell what happened and that the car would be there by mid-afternoon. I initially was going to drive it back to Pasadena, but a kind sheriff in Moorpark told me I had better have it towed. We had a nice chat and he was very helpful.

I asked everyone at the dealer if this had occurred before in their experience and their answer was a universal no. Every person I talked to, the sheriff, the tow truck, car guys, mechanics, Davie (my State Farm insurance agent), said they had never ever heard of this happening in their memory.

I am now trying to sort out the whole mess. The dealer (Porsche) needs to find out what actually happened. What were the series of signals that caused the deployment? How could this trigger-signal bypass all the check & balances in the computer circuitry? What would have happened if the bag(s) deployment occurred while in motion and causing subsequent accident, or better yet having the bags deployed and causing an accident with no airbag protection during the impact? Scary stuff the more I think about it.

AFTERMATH - Day 2

I stopped by the dealer this morning to check on the status of my car. Yesterday they immediately took the car into the shop to down load all the computer codes. They verified that I was not moving. I am told direction of investigation and any repair work is out of the dealer's hands. They are waiting for instructions from Porsche Cars North America (PCNA) and most likely Porsche Germany. The more I get into the possible liability and safety issues related to this type of incident, I have strong feeling my car may go back to Germany for complete tear down. Porsche cannot pussy foot around this one.

Nice story, huh. I wish it was made up. Sorry not the case. I welcome your advice, suggestion or any previous experience in such matters. Pictures follow.

Thanks for listening, Tom

Nice domed cobwebbed windshield. this is just from the passenger airbag exploding.

This view shows all three deployed. The third on is under the dash board. It is the one that made contact with my shins. Fortunately the steering wheel bag did not make contact with my face.

As you can see there not a mark or scratch on the car, except for the shattered windshield. Pretty serious impact to cause the airbags to exploded.

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[flash]

well, he won't have a case regarding the airbags.



the problem is that you are NOT SUPPOSED TO DRIVE THE CAR AFTER THE DEPLOYMENT OF AN AIRBAG. it says it clearly in the manuals, as well as other safety literature that comes with the car. it doesn't matter if he was late for an appointment, or could see out of the windshield or not. the fact of the matter is that you are not supposed to start the car again until it is serviced. if you do, you do so at your own risk.



this is another hot coffee scenario. we all know better, yet some yutz is going to ignore common knowledge, screw up, and then blame somebody else for it.

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[94SilverCab]

I think he will have a case based solely on the first deployment. I agree, he shoulld not have tried to start the car a second time, but that will not negate his overall success in pursuing a claim. Porsche will pay up, because the class action will be a killer for them if they don't.



JMO,



Jay

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[flash]

he ignored the instructions. any first year law student will tell you that ignorance is no excuse.



frankly i am surprised that the car was able to move more than 10mph. when an airbag is deployed, as a safety precaution, it is supposed to disable drivability until serviced. in many cars, the fuel pump is disabled. in others, the ECU is put in "limp" mode to allow getting it out of the way and into a safe location off the road, but does not allow it to be driven beyond that. they are all supposed to prevent driving with deployed airbags though.



he should have an actionable claim to fix his car though so that when the airbag is deployed it disables the car, like it should have in the first place.

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