[ds968]

Didn’t get around to the distributor during the weekend, but in the meantime I searched to see if I can find a single plug wire / cable .  

I checked Pelican Parts, CARid, Parts Geek, and a general search on eBay and Amazon, without any luck .  Only full sets are available.  And nothing in blue ( Beru brand , which I have now ) .  Not sure I understand the vast price differences between wire sets either ; looks like it goes from about $ 120 to $ 750 !!   I get that there are various degrees of quality of the wires depending on who makes them, and I don’t want to buy the cheapest stuff out there, but the other extreme seems nuts.   NGK makes a set for about $ 350 IIRC .   What do you guys think ?  Any recommendations?

 

I’ll still try to fix this uncoupled one, just not so confident in my ability , unless it’s really very simple . But I won’t be able to tell until I cut a slit in the rubber boot to see what’s what in there .. 

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[Roboman]

Dan there's a good chance the ignition wire has a collar crimped onto it which has a screw thread sticking out of it.  This screws into the plug holder ..... I'll take a photo of mine later, but right now I must go out. You might help things by spraying a bit of WD40 into where the cable goes into plug holder and leaving it for a while, it may improve things if you need to unscrew the cable.  I did mine a few weeks back and found the screw thread and collar were a bit corroded/oxidised. Robo

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[ds968]

Great, thanks !!  A photo would help to compare with this :

 

This is the end i think you’re referring to .. here’s what mine looks like : 


​    

 

This is a photo of the other end to which the wire plugs into , but I can’t see anything in there to which the wire would fit inside — I was expecting some metal connector protruding out, but it looks just like an empty space ...  is that the way it’s supposed to be ?!   ( considering it fires up and runs just fine when I slide the wire in that “empty “ space. )  


   

 

Also guessing all that green stuff is likely corrosion ?  Or normal after only 18 K miles ?    If it is corrosion then I may as well change the wires .. 

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[Roboman]

   



Here you go .... so the plug holder twists onto the cable .... hence the WD40 to ease matters along.

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[ds968]

Wow, this is totally different than mine ( our posts crossed in cyberspace ) I’m missing that metal tube… must have fallen off when the two ends came apart , and I didn’t notice it … 


How in the world does this car run like that ?!!  :o

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[Roboman]

Yes it looks like the connector has come right out of the plug holder..... you can see my connector glinting at the back ....

 

   

 

Sorry for the quality of the previous photos, I was in a hurry .....

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[Waylander]

I was going to add that to the list

The crankshaft position sensor is buried at the rear of the engine just to the right and behind the oil cap, the connectors get old and crusty just like the cam position sensor( plug just behind the belt cover on the cam cover) this might also cause an issue if its falling apart



When the cam sensor stops sending a signal the ignition gets retarded a lot





Worth checking the state of these two connections

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[ds968]

Thanks all.   Yeah, getting new wires set, new distributor , ( looks like both are needed no matter what ) and if the symptom persists , I’ll take it to a mechanic to check the other things .. 

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[ds968]

So I replaced the distributor , the rotor, and the wires .   Prior to that I removed all the spark plugs just to look at their condition ; good news , bad news :   all the plugs look great , BUT the # 2 plug  0-ring ( aka gasket ? ) is shot , so there’s more oil in there than the Alaskan pipeline reservoir.      Not sure if that would cause that hesitation I mentioned,  but I’ll find out tomorrow when I drive to work  .  Either way , I think I need to take it to a mechanic and have all of those replaced.    That won’t be cheap, mechanics here charge about $ 200 / hr, and considering the valve cover needs to come off ,I guess we’re  probably talking about 5-6 hours job.. 

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[tejon007]

Give yourself some credit. If you can replace the spark plug wires and plugs, you could most likely replace a valve cover gasket.



Bigger question is what are you gonna do with the $1,000 to $1,200 you're "saving"??

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[ds968]

Give yourself some credit. If you can replace the spark plug wires and plugs, you could most likely replace a valve cover gasket.



Bigger question is what are you gonna do with the $1,000 to $1,200 you're "saving"??

Ha, I wish I had your confidence …but I don’t .   As much as I’d love to save the cost,  there is no way I’m capable of taking on that big of a task.   

 

I wonder how long I’ve been driving with a pool of oil in the plug slot .   Months ?  Years ?   Unless it just happened and that’s what’s causing the symptom .     Will find out today , driving to work .   Unless of course it’s something entirely different causing the hesitation .  

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[ds968]

The drama continues..  the car drives fine, but it still stumbles on substantially hard acceleration ( although not at WOT ! ) .   And it only stumbles once out of about ten times when accelerating sharply .   Drove it to work ( about 20 minutes ) , parked it for about four hours, drove it back for another 20 minutes , still only one stumble on acceleration .  Stopped by a grocery store close to the house , came out and fired up the car and it died right away .   Tried it again , died again.   Third time same thing .   Waited about two minutes , started it again and this time it worked .   WTF ?!    That has never happened before in 25 years ! Now I’m thinking it may be the DME relay,  and has been since the symptoms started ..?   Lucky I have a spare DME , so will replace it tomorrow, and see it that makes any difference.     Any other theories ? 

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[tejon007]

I really loathe guessing, so I won't.



Sure, swap out the DME for a known good one.



But, I also do agree with Waylander that checking the crankshaft position and cam sensors makes a lot of sense (pun intentional).

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[ds968]

This is way above my head now, so those sensors can go bad suddenly and only manifest themselves infrequently and only in certain driving modes ?   In other words, perfectly fine 90% of the time, and just a hiccup here and there ?

 

Just adding to the list of what I’ll ask the mechanic to check and do .  

 

p.s. It was not easy finding a place knowledgeable and willing to work on a 968 here, particularly a supercharged one .  Everyone seems to shy away from it .   I’m not asking them to fix the SC, for heaven’s sake, everything else is the same as all other 968s !    One thing I miss for sure ; my former mechanic who retired.  And after that , also my friend who is a super “amateur” mechanic, who could be doing that for a living in his sleep if he wanted to ..but he lives in the SF Bay Area, and I am down here 500 miles away in the SoCal land .    I might convince him to come down for some complex repairs ,  even with the cost of hotel , flight , etc I may still come out ahead .   He is the most reasonable person I’ve know in terms of cost for his work on my car ( he has three 968s himself ) , often did jobs for just a sushi lunch or dinner … sigh . 

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[tejon007]

Well, would you call 30 years for the sensors, connectors and wiring to be potentially causing a problem...sudden?



And, yes Waylander is right, intermittent problems can be caused by crusty connections/wiring. Intermittent problems are caused by something, right?



Making this check "while you're in there" doesn't seem particularly difficult or time consuming (compared to many other repairs). Best wishes for a successful fix!

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[ds968]

True…

 

Thanks .

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[ds968]

Drove it today for about ten minutes with the new DME relay ;  hard  acceleration a few times,  turned it off for a couple of minutes and restarted it , and no symptoms at all .   I’ll drive it to work on Tuesday which has a lot more opportunities for acceleration, stop and go,  and so on, and we’ll see what happens .   I’d hate to think it was the DME relay all along and I spent $ 300 + on plug wires , distributor and rotor for nothing .   Well, they were probably due for  a change anyway , but my m.o. is always “ if it ain’t broke , don’t fix it “ ..   Regardless, I have to take it to the shop to replace the spark plug o rings and the valve cover gasket , while at it .   Guessing that running with all that oil in the plug well  for too much longer might eventually lead to bigger problems, although no idea what those woukd be… 

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[tejon007]

Hope that new DME fixes it!



Consumables like plugs, wires, distributor cap, rotor, etc. are just a cost of operating a Porsche (or any other ICE car). I probably change them more than others do, but I probably get better average MPGs too.



Of course if you want to drive around in a luxury sports car like a Porsche 968 (supercharged too!), you already know it'll cost you some...

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[Roboman]

We saw the condition of the ignition wires, so the distributor was probably likewise ..... you did a good thing to swap them out and not have to worry about them for a while.   

 

There might also be nothing wrong with the DME itself apart from a bit of corrosion on the plug/socket/contacts, which you inadvertently cleaned during the removal/insertion process.  How many of us have benefitted for removing our display units, cleaning the contacts, and putting them back...... tell me you're not now scrabbling through the trash to retrieve the old one

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[ds968]

Yeah,  at least one of the wires was shot .   Didn’t really pull the other ones apart to see if they were in similarly bad condition, but makes sense that they most likely must have been…. The distributor’s rotor did not look horrible , but definitely at a stage where a new one made sense .  

 

Haha, I saved the old DME relay .. did not toss it yet, keeping it until I get a a new spare ( just ordered one )

I always keep a new spare in the car .  

 

Now that you mentioned it , I wonder if I should use electronics cleaning spray on the old DME, and also in the port spaces, let it dry well ,  put it back in, and see if it was indeed just dirty contacts that caused those symptoms .    But the real test will be driving the car to the mechanic who is about 25 minutes away .. that’ll indicate if he needs to change just the plug o-rings and valve cover gasket , or, he will have to troubleshot the stumbling if it’s still happening .. just because it didn’t do it on the short test drive with the new DME relay , it’s no guarantee  ( although I am hoping that relay could have been the culprit ) 

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