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Running directional tires "backwards"?
#1

I decided to start a new thread, since this is a very specific question that isn't directly related to the one I asked in my other recent tire-related thread.



I finally got hold of Toyo, and asked them what exactly happens if you run a direction tires, such as the Proxes R1R, on the "wrong" side of the car (so against the recommended rotation). The answer? Nothing. The rep told me this is a question they get asked a lot, and he told me the tires (at least Toyo's directional models) are all constructed identically across the entire section of the tire. The only purpose of the directional tread, and this was consistent with the research I had done, is to improve the channeling of water. So he said it's perfectly fine to rotate them side to side, particularly on a track car, to even out the wear. But he advised caution when driving in the rain when mounted in the "reverse" direction. However, given the results of Tire Rack's test, where they didn't even detect any difference, either in lap times, or subjective feel, in the wet, even this seems to be a minor issue at most. I almost never drive my car in the rain anyway, and when I do, I always exercise extreme caution, so this is a non-issue for me. So, once my current (directional) tires wear out (and I'm going to go ahead and rotate them side-to-side to extend their life), I think I'm going to go ahead and switch to a square 17 x 9 set-up, with the 245/35R17 R1R's, which are the only tires on the planet that come in that size.
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#2

congratulations!
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94 Midnight Metallic Blue Cab Porsche 968 w/deviating cashmere/black interior and WAY too many mods to list - thanks to eric for creating www.968forums.com



"It isn't nearly as expensive to do it right as it is to do it wrong."
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#3

[quote name='flash' timestamp='1383949306' post='151926']

congratulations!

[/quote]

You mean for starting a new thread? - lol
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#4

lol - no - for finally finding enough vindication to support the square setup. i think you will like it, assuming you can also let go of the goofy spring setup that the "experts" want to run. it will only work though, as a part of a complete setup. if the rear is still sprung too stiff, it will swing out. if the roll is still too much, it will both push and swing. if there is too much negative camber, same thing.



but that is what a drafting table is for (yes, i'm that old - never did get used to CAD)



but, one thing at a time
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94 Midnight Metallic Blue Cab Porsche 968 w/deviating cashmere/black interior and WAY too many mods to list - thanks to eric for creating www.968forums.com



"It isn't nearly as expensive to do it right as it is to do it wrong."
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#5

What happens to the old rims?
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#6

lol - they get mounted on the car that will be behind him
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94 Midnight Metallic Blue Cab Porsche 968 w/deviating cashmere/black interior and WAY too many mods to list - thanks to eric for creating www.968forums.com



"It isn't nearly as expensive to do it right as it is to do it wrong."
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#7

Congrats on getting to the end. As I said in our discussion. Seems like everyone at the races uses a square setup, so there must be something right about it. Glad it worked out that way. You must feel good knowing this will also fit your budget.



Now, get out there and get some seat time!!



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#8

One thing I would caution about running "backwards". I'm sure Tire Rack's test was with new tires. Hydroplaning characteristics can change a lot when the tread depth is a fraction of the original. I'd caution that under this condition you might see a lot bigger difference between running directional tires forwards vs. backwards. So, if you swap them to the other side when worn, and run "backwards" be extra careful if you find yourself in one of those heavy Midwestern downpours.
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#9

Well, first of all, the existing tires still have a fair amount of thread left, but once they're worn out, assuming I've proven to myself I like the square set-up, I'm sure I could get a decent amount for them, especially since they're practically new, without a scratch on them. They're very sharp-looking wheels, and relatively light for 18-inchers.



My one bit of skepticism over whether a 17" square set-up is going to be that superior to what I have now is the reaction of the instructors when they've driven my car. In particular, the son of the track owner races professionally in Grand-Am. Not sure what class, but he drives a wicked-looking Lotus Evora, and he was positively flabbergasted with how well my car handles, and how easy it is to drive fast. However, he wasn't timing himself, so there's no telling how fast my car could be with this set-up vs. an alternate one. That will have to wait until I get some actual comparative data.



MB,



Not worried about driving in the rain. That only happens when I'm caught off-guard, which is very rare, since I watch the weather reports pretty regularly.
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#10

I did two events in the rain this year. Last year at Watkins Glen it started to rain before my first run on the third day and I decided not to. Mind you my head was contaminated after kissing the wall the first day. Apart from soaking the car because the windows must remain open, I found it to be a useful training exercise. You don't run that fast and this will give one the opportunity of experiencing the seat talking to you. This in itself is worth the time, fear and wet car! Of course you must have the correct tires on to do this!
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#11

I think a lot of guys run the 18x8.5/10 because of the PCA rule book. You cannot run 17x9 all the way around and remain in stock class. You're only allowed a 1" wider wheel.



For DE I'm sticking to a square setup once I get another set of wheels.
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#12

I have found my gas tank overflows if I run my tires backwards.
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#13

I only run my tires backwards when i am in reverse.

What is this square setup you keep referring to?
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#14

same size wheel and tire all around
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94 Midnight Metallic Blue Cab Porsche 968 w/deviating cashmere/black interior and WAY too many mods to list - thanks to eric for creating www.968forums.com



"It isn't nearly as expensive to do it right as it is to do it wrong."
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#15

Joel,



Yes, that's correct, and that's one of the reasons I went with the set-up I have. But given that it's going to be a long time before I race this car (no trailer, tow vehicle, or land or money for either), I realize this was a mistake, cost-wise, but one that puts me in a position to make direct comparison between the two set-ups on the same car.
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#16

Thanks Flash, that is what I thought.
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#17

Cloud,



I figured that's why you did the 18's. Agreed on the costs... I just replaced my truck of 17 years today. Now I am ready to get an enclosed when needed.
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#18

Yeah, I should have done more comparison shopping before getting the 18's. I figured that since 18's are so common now, there wouldn't be much of a price jump from 17" to 18", but it's huge. And then being staggered really compounds the problem by not being able to rotate front to back.
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