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help me remember
#1

Hey, what is the super common really expensive problem our cars have with the rear axle where it sounds like a jet engine when it goes? I think I have it, but don't see any posts about it in the 'posts every owner should read' section and I can't remember the cause or name of this problem to search for it...



But I know you all know what I'm talking about.



Thanks!
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#2

Pinion bearing. I just went through it.



Seems like there have been several occurences in the past couple months...
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#3

Just so others don't get too worried - I think the characterization of pinion bearing failure as "super common" is a bit of an exaggeration. That said, though, it has happened to more cars than we'd like to have seen.
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#4

[quote name='Anchorman' date='Aug 17 2005, 03:39 AM']Just so others don't get too worried - I think the characterization of pinion bearing failure as "super common" is a bit of an exaggeration.  That said, though, it has happened to more cars than we'd like to have seen.

[right][post="8855"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right][/quote]



Sorry, you are right. I didn't mean to imply that. Just that the discussion about them is common enough that anyone here with a reasonable brain will know what it is. (Which doesn't include me because I couldn't remember for the life of me! <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/smile.gif" class="smilie" alt="" />



Thanks, I'll do some research. Pray mine hasn't gone, or I might just have to send it over a cliff <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/smile.gif" class="smilie" alt="" />



Mark
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#5

Good excuse to put in a nice LSD, I'm half hoping mine goes.
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#6

What were the symptoms again? And how do you tell for sure?
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#7

lots of descriptive info on 968.net if you do a search for " pinion bearing noise ", but the quick answer: jet ( engine ) taxi-ing on the runway type of sound, a bit more muffled / subtle , of course, and consistently audible both driving and while coasting in neutral. The latter IMO is the KEY tell tale. In most cases you'll need to get above 40 or 50 mph to hear it unless the bearing is really bad and then it'll make the sound even at lower speeds. Tire howling can also add to the diagnosis problem ( but those do not sound like a jet ) so one way to tell for sure ( or, almost sure..) is to get the car on a lift and run it in gear listening with a stethoscope to the differential - that way there is no load on the wheels and you can rule out a bad rear wheel bearing ( unless those are in really poor shape and they'll whine even without load.. )



Actually the best way is to find a local 968 owner who has had the problem and is familiar with the sound. That's what I did. He called it in 10 seconds after riding in the car.



Around this area you're looking at $ 1,800 - $ 2,000 P&L.
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#8

Mine seems to make some type of noise that I would describe as a quiet jet engine. It only seems to do this when I get up to speed, and then coast (take my foot off the gas). The minute I apply the brakes, it goes away.
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#9

Mark,



coasting by just taking your foot off the gas... the car is still in gear, right ?



take it out of gear and coast in neutral to see if you hear that quiet jet engine sound... if you do, I'm afraid there is a pretty good chance it's the pinion



I do not remember if my noise stopped immediately when I applied the breaks though.. but as the car slows down if you pay close attention you should still hear that jet whine also slowing and fading ( almost in sync with the car's speed )...

...a winding down sound



However, if I remember correctly, on acceleration - slow or fast. the sound did not get louder past the point when it became audible - it stayed fairly consistent whether you're going 60 mph or 80 mph or 100 mph, but as I mentioned earlier there is a slight winding down effect as the car's speed lowers
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#10

I haven't tried in in neutral yet. Will do this weekend...
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#11

well, I did some testing. The noise goes away if I take the car out of gear. So I'm guessing this means it is NOT the pinion bearing problem? It also goes away if I brake. And doesn't seem to show up when I accelerate. Only when I coast, in gear, at speeds over about 40mph.



Any thoughts?



Thanks!

Mark
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#12

Coasting out of gear or braking does not rule it out. It actually is consistent with a pinion bearing noise. When you coast in gear, you put load on the bearing and cause it to make noise if it is pitted. When you brake or coast in neutral the bearing not not doing much work and it won't make much niose. I don't want to piss in your wheaties, but I think you might need a professional ear to listen to it to confirm.
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#13

Yeah, after reading more about the problem just now, I'm actually more worried that I do indeed have this problem. The noise is really unmistakable in my mind, it sounds just like a jet engine winding down.



My only hope is that I have about 108K miles on the car, and it seems there are only maybe one or two others that have had this come up over 100K miles. So I'm really looking for some other explanation. Plus I don't want to pay the $2000 to fix it, I desperately need a new paint job instead <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/smile.gif" class="smilie" alt="" />



Should I call the dealership here about checking this out, or would any good Porsche mechanic understand this problem and be able to help?



Thanks!

Mark
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#14

Find a reputable independent mechanic. The dealer mechanics only work on new cars. The truly good mechanics leave the dealer and become indies.
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#15

Odd.



The noise my pinion made was as noticeable in neutral / coast as it was in gear... so load did not play a role there ( at least, not an audible difference to my ears ).



Furthermore, the only culprit was a single "pit" which was no bigger than the size of a pinhead and the depth was little more than a surface scratch - everything else looked pretty darn new, and to this day I am still amazed that negligible defect alone could have caused all that jet engine whine... but it did.



So, provided it is your pinion I wonder if it's another type of damage ( not pitting )

...a heat warped surface ? which might manifest itself with different symptoms, where in neutral you escape just enough load and friction to mitigate the noise ?



Not sure how easy it is to find someone locally who has done pinion jobs on 968s so as to diagnose this with confidence - that would be the ideal way to handle it.

( most dealers have no clue and are unwilling to offer a money-back guarantee if they do the work based on their best guess that it's the pinion, and then much to your dismay you realize something else may be the source of the noise.. )



But.. at the proverbial "end of the day"... a distinct JET ENGINE WHINE sound =

99% probability of a bad pinion bearing according to personal experience and the significant amount of time I spent checking with multiple sources, mechanics, etc.. However, this is too much $$ to risk relying on subjective based factors such as sound, subtle differences in different gears, etc.. A stethoscope and a professional ear ( as Dave suggested ) is definitely indicated.
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