[flash]

they were the correct mounts. i checked that already from the paperwork. they were also perfect when i had the car here. you can tell by the measurement between the fuel rail cover and the strut tower brace.



that being said, i can understand why he thinks they're shot. if he had a chance to feel another tip, he would just shake his head.

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[schwarz968]

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[Ernie]

Things are getting kinda weird around here! Lmao!

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[ds968]

[quote name='flash' timestamp='1406247558' post='160475']they were the correct mounts. i checked that already from the paperwork. they were also perfect when i had the car here. you can tell by the measurement between the fuel rail cover and the strut tower brace.

that being said, i can understand why he thinks they're shot. if he had a chance to feel another tip, he would just shake his head.[/quote]



When I drove your white cab briefly, I don't recall it being anyway nearly as pronounced ( I'd say less than half...if even that much ..) but maybe that's not something to which I paid attention at the time , and besides it did not sit idling too long so that may have something to do with it. I'll see if Trevor has some time to provide a live testing opinion since he had a tip and thus as good of a frame of reference as it gets.



Unfortunately no strut tower brace on this car, I'd have to install the one from my other 968 and measure the distance, but wonder if there's easier way to set up a comparison to someone who has fairly new motor mounts ?

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[type968]

[quote name='flash' timestamp='1406247558' post='160475']

they were the correct mounts. i checked that already from the paperwork. they were also perfect when i had the car here. you can tell by the measurement between the fuel rail cover and the strut tower brace.



that being said, i can understand why he thinks they're shot. if he had a chance to feel another tip, he would just shake his head.

[/quote]



What is the measurement? And what points precisely do you measure from?



Thanks!

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[type968]

[quote name='ds968' timestamp='1406245302' post='160473']

I have to check mine as well, even though I learned that tip cars vibrate much more than six speeds because of the flex plate , this damn car shakes worse than Michael J Fox riding an epileptic horse. ( What ! Too soon ? :-) ) The motor mounts are just about one year old and 15 k miles on it, but as noted in the previous post I have no idea if they're aftermarket and just failed miserably . My mechanic swears they're shot just by how tne car feels, he did not have a chance today ( when I was there for other things ) to measure or test them.

[/quote]



It has been soooo long since my last 944s (951, 944S2 Cab, and a 968 Tip) that I can't remember how much they vibrated (plus 15 years - 20 years ago I had a lot less money to spend on these cars, so I skipped many a thing) But I swear the last few weeks at idle the shake has increased.



So would like to inspect them and replace if required (150k on the car and I dont see them being changed in the last 60k)

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[flash]

if you have a Design 1 Racing strut tower brace, then you would be looking to see a measurement of about 10mm at the front edge of the brace down to the fuel rail cover. if you have more than that, then the mounts are sagging. at that point you need to measure the mounts themselves. i think 63mm is the throwaway point.

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[Bulti]

Is there a way to tell the difference of OEM ones vs aftermarket?

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[flash]

not that i know of

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[ds968]

I'm thinking it's also possible that the natural vibration of the tip cars causes the motor mounts to wear out at a lot faster rate .. <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/huh.png" class="smilie" alt="" /> , then compound that by the torque of the SC everytime you step on the gas with determination, and maybe their life is pretty damn short by comparison to NA six speeds.. but only after 15K miles still seems waaay to quickly <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/glare.gif" class="smilie" alt="" />

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[flash]

i'm all but certain that your mounts are fine. the next time you are down here, i'll have you drive the white car. you'll see that it is just the nature of the beast.

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[type968]

Cool, thanks, I do have your brace, will measure this weekend.



[quote name='flash' timestamp='1406262234' post='160481']

if you have a Design 1 Racing strut tower brace, then you would be looking to see a measurement of about 10mm at the front edge of the brace down to the fuel rail cover. if you have more than that, then the mounts are sagging. at that point you need to measure the mounts themselves. i think 63mm is the throwaway point.

[/quote]

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[type968]

Looks like I have 9-10mm, so I am good to go!

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[williamoss]

someone asked for the cost of the motor mounts from Sunset. I just paid $180 each a couple of weeks ago, and they had them in stock.

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[ds968]

This is about as unscientific as it gets, lol, but could anyone with fairly new motor mounts take a couple of measurements at the same points ( see below ), just for a rough comparison ? In these two photos I measured the positioning of the fuel rail cover vs the frame : 1) the top edge of the cover at the rear of the engine is perfectly level with the top line of the plastic band / strip on which the rubber moulding sits. I used a leveler to make sure the connection I made between those two points was not tilted at all. Not even a mm difference there. 2) the top edge of the cover at the front is exactly 1/2 " above the yellow wire which is set right up against the front of the fuel rail cover and connecting the frame on each side. Like I said, very unscientific, but still wondering what others come up with using the same method...assuming anyone has the time and interest to mess around with this silly stuff :-)

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[williamoss]

As you spent "How much for the super charger" then investing another $360 in brand new motor mounts is cheap by comparison. And you must have to knowledge and the ability to install them your self. MY mechanic did it with the engine in the car, but it took a lot of strength and know how to do it on a lift. It took him about 2-3 hours to install them. After we installed them the engine sounded quieter to both of us, so I was there was a rattle in either the engine or the exhaust.



do you have a brace that goes from one side to the other on the top of the shock towers. There is a lower brace also, makes the car handle a lot better. do not know the actual names for them but it came on my car that I bought from RS Barn. I am sure Pete could tell you about them. I do not see it in the picture which is why I asked.

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[ds968]

[quote name='williamoss' timestamp='1406481995' post='160536']As you spent "How much for the super charger" then investing another $360 in brand new motor mounts is cheap by comparison. And you must have to knowledge and the ability to install them your self. MY mechanic did it with the engine in the car, but it took a lot of strength and know how to do it on a lift. It took him about 2-3 hours to install them. After we installed them the engine sounded quieter to both of us, so I was there was a rattle in either the engine or the exhaust.

do you have a brace that goes from one side to the other on the top of the shock towers. There is a lower brace also, makes the car handle a lot better. do not know the actual names for them but it came on my car that I bought from RS Barn. I am sure Pete could tell you about them. I do not see it in the picture which is why I asked.[/quote]



Knowledge and ability to install them myself ??!!! Ha, I can barely manage to replace windshield wiper blades myself, LOL. IIRC, my mechanic charged 4 hrs to install the last set, so that's $ 500 and another $ 360 on top of that for something I MAY NOT need is tough to justify ..unless it's pretty sure I do need them or they would help materially reducing the vibration.

I have both the D1R strut tower brace and the D1R lower suspension brace in my other 968, but I'm not about to take it off and install the brackets, etc on this car just to measure the distance to the rail cover , and them remove it and reinstall back on the other car.

Other than that, what relevance do the braces have to the motor mounts , it's not as if the mitigate the vibration in any way...

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[williamoss]

I did not mention the braces as a way to measure the height nor the cost of installing them. I mentioned them because your picture did not show them, and I thought I would mention them to you incase you were unaware they existed. AS I did say installing them in my 95 coupe with 89,000 miles on it DID reduce the vibration. Perhaps you might want o install them on both cars and then you would not have to uninstall them on the other car, install them measure and un install them and re install them on the first car . LOL <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/clap.gif" class="smilie" alt="" /> <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/clap.gif" class="smilie" alt="" />

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[ds968]

I'm surprised they make a positive difference at all in engine vibration. I know that my car felt as if it had a tighter ride with them ( well, once I installed the lower one, I could not feel any difference with just the top ) but I would think connecting the strut towers as well as the caster blocks would cause any existing vibration to be carried into all of the frame and cause an even more pronounced shake you would feel ... Wouldn't it ?

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[flash]

i have not seen or heard of it in any car i have had any of my braces installed into though, and there are a few hundred of them. by the way william, i'm pretty sure you have my braces too.



that being said, it's possible. being a unibody car, it is more apt to transfer load. tying one point that is vibrating to another point in the car, increases the mass of the item being vibrated, making it more resistant. since the vibration is a pulsing action, as the engine is attempting to rotate, the strut tower brace would tend resist that rotation, transferring the force to front one strut tower, which is attached to the frame rail and thereby the crossmember, to the other. since for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction, as one strut tower is being pushed, the other would be pulled. the brace would tend to negate both of these, as it would then use the rest of the car as a counterweight.



the downside of that is it places more stress on the motor mounts and tranny mount. this will likely decrease the lifespan of the mounts, but i doubt that it will be significant, as the amount of force is minimal. it's enough to create vibration, but not enough to really stress a component designed to handle exactly this kind of vibration.

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