[garylimey]

Running my car at 3200lbs plus in order to make class, I set a new track record in 944SuperCup with my 968 at WGI. However during the last lap the tyres let go and the car is totalled.
I was told by the Hoosier rep to add more pressure and run them at 42 to 44psi hot. Needless to say that they turned greasy very quickly and the car drifted out when tracking out towards the laces. Bottom line the car is totalled but fortunately I survived.
However if it were not for me having my bolt in cage customised I would not be here now.


http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o84/gar...ey/IMG_2468.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o84/gar...ey/IMG_2466.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o84/gar...ey/IMG_2476.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o84/gar...ey/IMG_2479.jpg

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[pmcrespo]

I already commented on Rennlist and NJJR forums Gary, but re-looking at the pics, I believe you definitely cashed-in a few more credits than I did in walking away from this one. And I'll say it for the third time.... SO GLAD you are ok and in great spirits. You'll replace the ride. and three words for you: Custom Welded Cage. Plus... dude! 40-42 pre set!!!!?????? Crazeee talk....

Seriously. You are unhurt. That rocks.

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[ds968]

Oh, sorry to see this ( certainly glad you're ok though ).

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[benspeeder]

Ahhhhh MAN! DANG That is a major major bummer. Congrats on the record but that's a small solice to a beatiful 968 wrecked. Very glad you are unhurt. Can you offer more detail on how the crash occured?

Were you running the in-car video?


40-42 lbs is just where I like running the R6 hot but the preset should be around 32-34 lbs depending on the weather etc.

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[wmuldowney]

Of course after the fact everybody's an expert and we all like to sideline line quarterback, I write this as a recap/observation only, and if I have any of this wrong please correct me.

At 40-42 lbs, which is a bit hard plus the hot day, and a hotter track and of course the the natural tendency of the tire to expand with the heat. At that point the contact area would have diminished by about 15% and the rubber would be greasy, as you mentioned, those tires would be way to hard and way too slippery.

This of course is my humble opinion and just thinking out loud as I am think about getting back into some form of racing again soon.

And how did you ever contain yourself from boxing the ears of the Hoosier Rep?

Any day you can get out of the car relatively unscathed, is still a good day of racing. Glad not hurt and sorry about the car, that is a big bummer.

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[garylimey]

<!--quoteo(post=73004:date=Jun 2 2009, 07:31 AM:name=benspeeder)-->QUOTE (benspeeder @ Jun 2 2009, 07:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Ahhhhh MAN! DANG That is a major major bummer. Congrats on the record but that's a small solice to a beatiful 968 wrecked. Very glad you are unhurt. Can you offer more detail on how the crash occured?

Were you running the in-car video?


40-42 lbs is just where I like running the R6 hot but the preset should be around 32-34 lbs depending on the weather etc.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Yes I have video but the crash scene would probably cause 50% of us to be banned from racing if our families saw it. It is a youtube fame video but not a chance.

However I'll show it personally to my friends including you [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif[/img] who would like to see it.

The tyres were at 42 psi after the warm ups. The racer behind and the corner workers said that the car seemed to stop steering and drift out to the rumble strips, as the rear started to come round I was catching it according to the corner worker but it just suddenly let go completely at the rumble strips.
Once the car was beyond control I let the steering wheel go and put both feet in so I would at least be predictable. The car shot backwards down and accross the track into the grass which was soaked from several days previous rain. I stayd straight so's not to spin again and turn into a whirlkwind on the track where other cars would then be involved. My drivers rear corner hit the tyre wall and I was repelled over 6 feet into the air while rotating and landing on the roof followed by me rolling over and back onto the roof. That was how the corner worker described it to me the next day.
My helmet had several cracks from the impact of my head against the roof when the cage was compressed.
NO JOKE!!! I was 1/2 inch from my head being compressed even more to the point of not being here. I was trapped by the collapsed roof.
Only 4 things saved me. 1st, a great helmet, HJC SI-12, 2nd, custom work done to the bolt in cage that not only bent a lot more at the bend but also cracked at the weld point. 3rd, we lowered the seat to the floor to give plenty of head room. 4th, somebody likes me and decided it wasn't my time yet.
Had the cage not been modified and my head would have been crushed!!!
Please every one who race's and has this type of cage don't ignore what could have happened to me, add in a dash bar, a diagonal that goes to the bottom of the main hoop, legal harness bar at the correct height. You should go further than I did and also strenthen the bend on the down tube as it is not thick enough.
Bottom line, you will never get me in that type of cage again!!.

BTW, when I spoke to someone about the cage and improving it, well lets just say I was VERY disapointed, especially with the answer of "well it's FIA approved and it was not a normal rollover". My answer's did not seem to be received very well, I guess we will have to wait for a fatality before the cage is improved for a car that gets air born.
Sorry I just feel very strongly about this and do not want to see any friends get hurt.

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[wmuldowney]

I have never understood the attitude "well its approved, why fix"

I have always thought as new things are learned, usually the hard way with racing, they should be improved upon. As you mentioned as relatively minor add-on cross brace would improve structural integrity a lot. One thing you did mention was a cracked weld, thats a defect/bad weld, it should never crack or break on a weld!
Video would be awesome. Know what you mean about showing family video/pics, I used to work on microwave towers, 300-2100' feet up. Nobody really knew what I did till they saw the pics.

Again, glad not hurt and thanks for the info

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[benspeeder]

Gary - I remember us trading some messages on cages. I went with a full custom cage - Pete just got the car back from the fabricator and sent me some pics - it's an excellent job and has the key safety features.

You are a lucky man - record holding survivor.

I will send you a PM - would like to chat with ya and see the footage.

Some cage pics:

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[94SilverCab]

Hey Gary,

I'm not a race car guy, but very glad to hear that you are ok. Terrible shame about the car, but walking away is the best reward.

Regards,

Jay

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[Anchorman]

Gary, OMG! As I started to read the first post, I said to myself "What was the lap time?" - then I saw there was much more to the story than the lap time.

I HATE those last laps!

Really glad you're OK. Having driven at WG many times, I'd be very appreciative of finding a way to see the video. Is there anyway you can post it someplace with some kind of security/password protection?

Best,

Jim

...and, looking at the full title of the thread, I see the lap time. I cannot believe how slow I am - probably a full 30 seconds off your record pace. So, along with the condolences, CONGRATULATIONS!

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[biotechee]

Very relieved you are OK Gary.

Sorry about the car.

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[Eric_K]

Sorry to hear about the loss of the car but I'm glad you walked away. Best of luck on getting right back on the horse...

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[Fox944]

Wow, makes you realize the importance of having a good cage. Glad you are ok.

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[RS Barn]

Gary,
So glad you're ok. That brings back bad memories of Pablos car....
I'm glad we've put in a custom cage in Bens car. The bolt in style leave much to be desired.
Besides the horizontal cross bar we've added agle supports fot the main hoop and windshield crossbar and footwell intrusion bars. They played a significant roll in protecting Pablo. We just recently upgraded the Firehawk cage from original spec.
Pete

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[968gene]

Wow, glad you are OK. When I started my 944S track car build I went to a guy in Charleston, SC who builds Funny Cars to have my cage done. I spent about $2,500 on a chrome moly, custom built cage with 3 NASCAR bars etc. Everyone running a track car should learn from your near miss. Again, glad to hear you are doing well.

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[garylimey]

Thank you so much everyone for your thoughts and kind words [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/cool.gif[/img] .

Even though I'm very excited about my next car I'm sad that it's not a 968, especially as mine was the car I really started to learn in.
I had a great time in my car though, from learning how to drive on track to building it into and great race car. However although the car is gone now, the fantastic community I'm now a part of is what this is all about.
So for this reason I'm buying a 944 S2 Firehawk and will contiue on the same path of friends and racing that has given me so much.

I'm meeting the cage builder today who customised my cage to the point that I survived. Thanks for cage pic's Ben and Pete, I will be adding even more bars to the Firehawk cage. A 45' bar to the left of my head as shown in one of your pic's as well as the Petti bar and and brace from the Petti bar to the cross bar by the windshield. I do not want the roof caving in again [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/ohmy.gif[/img] .
It already has 2 door bars and a NASCAR door bar. It has a full fire suspression. We are moving all the goodies from my car into the new one especially the electrical cut of switch so I can once again be able to have and use if needed again a 2nd kill switch on the dash [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif[/img] .

It's looking like the car will be ready for G52 at the Glen in 2 weeks and racing in 2 and 1/2 weeks at NJMP in the 944SuperCup series.

I've put the video on my lap top which is nearly always with me, it doesn't bother me to watch it so if I see anyof you around you are welcome to see how it happened from inside the car.

If it's ok with you guy's I would like to post here occasionally to let you know how I'm doing and also see how my friends here are doing.

Think Safety 1st
Gary

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[benspeeder]

Way to keep on racing - glad you are staying with Porsche also. Maybe I can get down to NJMP for the SuperCup race. I haven't run with you guys before but it would be nice to see how my car and driving stacks up.

I getting hopeful we make it to NJMP for the national race and the PRO IT - will post video if we make it.

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[Anchorman]

Wow, Gary, quick recovery - terrific.

We'll have to start an "Alumni" section - we certainly don't want to lose folks like you.

BTW - the new car must be interesting, can't wait to see the 45' bar that's going to be to the left of your head - I guess jousting must be part of the new class you're racing in. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif[/img]

If you'll allow me a little digression...

In part because of what you just experienced, Gary, as well as what my son did during his last outing at WGI, we're looking more carefully and soberly at what we purchase for use as a track/DE car. I'm going to open up a separate thread in the Racing section...please visit and offer views, we need the benefit of eyes that know what they're looking at.

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[xrad]

WOW, first time I read this post, sorry you lost such a beautiful racer.

...even though it was not the best cage, it did seem to help. Glad to hear you are alive and well!

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[garylimey]

<!--quoteo(post=73405:date=Jun 6 2009, 09:19 PM:name=xrad)-->QUOTE (xrad @ Jun 6 2009, 09:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->WOW, first time I read this post, sorry you lost such a beautiful racer.

...even though it was not the best cage, it did seem to help. Glad to hear you are alive and well!<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Oh Yeah, it definitely helped however I'm not that tall and the seat was just about bolted on the floor. A cage is meant to absorb the impact which this definitely did but make sure that you have a good margin of error around you(plenty of head room [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif[/img] )
The install of the original cage was done well, but the additional custom cage work was what saved the day. However if you ever get a chance to see the car you would be amazed that I'm alive.
I want to take a picture with a level accross the roof showing just how much it came down as well as how important the dash bar is. The cage shifted over to the passenger side, had I not had a dash bar the cage would have collapsed accross onto me allowing it collapse down even more.
I actually wanted a dash bar incase of being T-boned.

Yes it was a beautiful and well set up fast race car. I spent the last year learning how to drive on track in it while gradually building it into a race car.
It has given me so many great memories as well a great start to racing.

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