[Anchorman]

Shifting the direction of this thread slightly - how do you experienced folks tie the car to trailer? I've seen straps systems that go over the tires, with tie-downs in front of, and in back of, each tire. Straps that go through the wheels, tieing to one point. Straps that connect to chassis points, then to the trailer. I'd appreciate views of what you do, and what works, with as much in specifics as possible. Is it important that straps cross between the car points and the trailer points? I'm having RS Barn install the KLA rear tow points, and I'm planning to use these as the trailer tiedown points for the rear. What should be used in front? What is easiest to connect to the trailer?



In advance, THANKS!!!



One other point - I think we've decided to equip the trailer with a winch. Everything I've read suggests that the winch rating should be 1.5 times the vehicle weight. However, I can't believe that's what's needed to pull the cars into the trailer - we're not trying to lift the cars onto the trailer roof. If anyone is "winching", what's your experience?

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[flash]

avoid running straps over bendable suspension components - also avoid running them over the wheels - the straps will move, flex and shift - this could damage any of the above



many people criss cross the straps left to right, on each end - this does help reduce side to side shift of the car - i do it at the rear, but not at the front, only because of difficulty getting under the front of the car to attach them



as for winch rate, yup - AT LEAST that much - try pushing that car uphill (the ramp) - think about how much more effort is required over pushing it on flat ground - then think about the winch rating



i blew up a 6500lb winch first time out - may have been defective - may have been overworked - not sure - was a cheap winch - i'm going with a much larger one next time though

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[mikeo]

Read this and decide for yourself. Personally, I think 1.5 x the weight of the load is ridiculous overkill. That winch would lift 4500lb straight up! Why do guys pick the big winch? For the same reason they pick the big watch 8^)



Another reason to go with a properly sized winch is the cable size. The bigger the cable the more unhandy it will be.

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[Anchorman]

BULLSEYE!!! Great link, exactly what I've been looking for, Mike, but was unable to find.



It was my understanding (without any supporting evidence) that winch ratings related to the weight that could be raised vertically - so even a 3,000 lb. winch struck me as more than enough to get the cars up the tailgate ramp and into the trailer. Based on some very conservative assumptions, the article supports the conclusion that such a winch would be more than adequate.



Yes, cable has also been a consideration. One local place I've talked to has identified a Warn winch - I think it's either 3,000 or 3,500 lb. rating - with 50' of cable. I don't think I'd want less cable, and I don't think I need more. The total trailer length is 45', so the length that the winch will see is probably about 38' or so, to which I need to add the tailgate (I don't have the dimension, but it's certainly not more than 8'), and assuming I use a strap at the end of the winch cable to connect to the car tow point, 50' sounds right. Again referring to the article, this would likely keep the winch in the "Pulling Power Zone" until the cars are off the ramp and in the trailer, at which point the power requirement falls drastically.



Again, Mike, THANKS!!!

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[mikeo]

De nada. I have the 3700 Warn winch. It was a deal I could not pass up. Here's a link to Warn's version of the Superwinch selection guide

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[biotechee]

Not that I know what I am talking about (because I don't), but I've heard "Warn" mentioned in good light within some Jeep circles. You could also poke around in some Jeep periodicals and such- those guys (especially the ones who are really into off-roading) will know who makes a superior winch.

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[Anchorman]

Thanks, Bio. I also don't know much about the topic - but I know that if someone asked me to name a winch brand, the only one that would have come to mind before I started this effort would have been Warn. That's very likely the direction I'll go. I don't need to over-research this, as - in the greater scheme of what's being invested in this rig - the winch is a very small portion, and if I get a good name with enough (but not too much) power, I'll have accomplished my objective.

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[flash]

warn has long had the reputation of being the best winch



not sure what exactly my problem was, but i know i toasted a cheapy that was rated a lot higher than the load i was pulling - i presumed it was the load - perhaps it was just junk - harbor freight - go figure - i was pretty pissed when it fried though



i was hoping i didn't need a big one like i did on the tow rig for the sandrail - we had to yank that thing out of a couple of tough spots, and the small winches couldn't do it - i had read this stuff before, and thought i could go small - looks like maybe i just got a bad one



i'm going to be doing this again in the next week or so, as i want to finish the inside of my trailer (thanks for the motivation jim - translation - tossing another project on the heap)

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[Anchorman]

Always glad to be of help, Bob. I'm expecting to get a quote today on a Warn in the 3500 lb range with 50' of cable. I'll let you know what I learn.



Tomorrow I take the truck from my son, get it inspected (hopefully successfully) and then bring it to Ford on Wednesday for a lot of stuff - catching up on maintenance and installing the new tires. Next Monday/Tuesday is my trip to Maine to get the trailer. Then the fun will really start.

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[Anchorman]

OK, now I really begin to show my ignorance - but what better place than among friends?



I now have the truck, with a beautiful Rhino spray-in bed liner and a gooseneck hitch in the bed with a 2-5/16" ball. I also have the trailer title, so I contacted Pace to learn more about the trailer. First of all, it's a MONSTER - 8-1/2' wide, 44' long, GVWR of 15,000 lbs, and a curb weight (without extras, of which there's at least one important one) of 7,640 lbs. The important extra is that it was built with an extra 6" of height, which makes it easier to use (the interior height is now 6'9") but adds weight. Payload is 7,360 lbs, less the weight of the extra height and whatever else there is (e.g., the trailer is prepped for a generator, but I don't believe there is one in it), so maybe there's 7,000 lbs of payload available. The 968 is supposed to weigh 3,240, leaving 3,760 for my son's Maserati and whatever else we put in the trailer - which is beginning to sound like not too much.



Anyway, I also may have a hitch issue. The truck now has a bed hitch with a 2-5/16" ball. According to the Pace information, the trailer has "a 2" Pin Box with Landing Gear". I don't know what that means - but I do know that 2" is not 2-5/16". I've called the place where the trailer is and asked them to confirm that the trailer will connect to a 2-5/16" ball. I haven't heard back from them yet. Does anyone know if I have a potential problem or not? I certainly don't want to get to Maine and find out that I can't connect the trailer to the truck.

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[flash]

a pin box is the receiver for the ball - it is a cushioned unit that absorbs shock - they are an air ride mechanism



2" should refer to the travel - however, i would verify that somehow



here is a link to some info on pin boxes:

http://www.3wtruckandequipment.com/accessories_14.htm



maybe they can help

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[Anchorman]

Learning, learning...thanks, Bob.



I get the sense that the 2" pin box that is standard on this trailer has nothing to do with the ball/receiver size - but if that's the case, I don't know what the 2" dimension is referring to. Hopefully I'll hear from the place in Maine where the trailer is currently parked and I can get this issue behind me.

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[jpk]

Sounds like you have a gooseneck hitch but you need a fifth wheel hitch; here are some pictures; the difference is pretty clear.



http://www.thehitchstore.com/?gclid=CPPfnM...CFQhJagodC1Df3Q

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[flash]

oh, he definitely has a gooseneck - no question about that part - he is asking about the hitch itself though, and just like with standard tongue hitches, there are a few different ones



if they used the description as in the link i posted, the 2" refers to the travel of the cushion - 1" up and 1" down

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[Anchorman]

That is the feeling that I'm starting to get. You're right, the difference is pretty clear - so before taking any further steps, I want to confirm what is on the trailer. Then I'll make sure the truck can mate with it. What may have thrown us off is the apparent fact that a gooseneck trailer doesn't necessarily have a gooseneck hitch. I'm hoping to nail this down today.

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[flash]

correct



based on the shot of the trailer, it may or may not ride correctly on your truck - definitely get height measurements and hitch matching info and such before going all the way up there

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[Anchorman]

Yup - I'm getting more convinced that there could be an issue. Looking at the photo more carefully, I noticed that the tow vehicle is as covered with snow as the trailer - suggesting that they may have been a matched pair. If that's the case, I'm guessing that tow vehicle had a fifth wheel, not a ball hitch. However, I can't guess. I just spoke to the trailer place again, pressing them for the needed details. Fingers crossed on the answer.



(10 minutes later...) The trailer company called and confirmed that the 2-5/16" ball will work with this trailer. That's very good news. Clearly that's a lot more to learn, but at least we lucked out on this.



So - the truck is in my local Ford dealer getting its new tires and lots of maintenance - plus state inspection. On Monday, I'll drive to Maine, test the trailer fit, get the rig weighed, stay overnight, and then drive back to north Jersey on Tuesday.



Stay tuned, and thanks for the help. I'm sure there are many more dumb questions to come.

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[flash]

the biggest thing, besides whether or not the truck hitch type matches the trailer hitch type, is going to be the relative height sets of the two - if the new truck, sits higher than the previous one, the load will be on the tail - this is BAD - if it sits lower than the previous one, it isn't good either, but at least not as unsafe



whichever it is, 5th wheel or gooseneck, a measurement from the ground to the trailer hitch component is in order - then a measurement from the ground to the top of your truck hitch component



just like tongue hitches, there are different length extensions to accommodate different height trucks



i actually have to go and have mine modified to get the nose of the trailer down another inch or so - right now it sits up too high, and costs me in both load capacity and aerodynamics

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[Anchorman]

Understood - that's something I'll deal with when I'm at the trailer place in Maine on Monday. They should have whatever I might need in terms of hitch extensions, etc., to get the trailer to ride level.



I have a feeling that parts of the ride back will be taken pretty slowly. It's been a long time since I've driven with a BIG trailer, and the 8-1/2' width is making me nervous enough to want to be REALLY careful - particularly going into toll booths! I also have to find out if there are roads that this rig will not be allowed on. Interstate haighways are not the issue - an important road in New Jersey is the Garden State Parkway, which doesn't allow trucks over a certain size and may have other restrictions. More research...

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[biotechee]

Jim-



Awesome! I've enjoyed reading this thread very much!



Only a couple of questions: is there room in the new trailer for the crew, and will you be installing bunks for us in which to sleep?! Perhaps, to keep costs down, just few hammocks suspended from the roof or something- doesn't have to be extravagent, but I do need a decent place to rest between races... with my bad back and all. And oh yeah- I really can't do much in the way of wrenching for you as part of your crew, but I can be your official head of cheerleading and beer consumption... <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/laugh.gif" class="smilie" alt="" />



If you really want to get down to the nitty gritty- I'll help you rip out your carpet when your voyage down the slippery slope turns into a free-fall!!!!



Congrats my friend- you and your son are going to have an incredible time! Live it up and have the most fun possible!

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