[19bwb67]

I thought I'd give this new forum a try! I orig posted this topic on 968.net but I have found the active feedback/support there to be waning. or maybe in this case I'm just impatient. Any way this is the feedback i've recieved so far. Thanks for any help. I am intrigued with going w wider tires/lower profile. I live for taking corners fast!





Hello all and thanks in advance.Time to talk tires. I currently have some yokohama db's(from orig owner) on my 968 cab and I HATE THEM. Thank God it is time to replace them. they are original spec on the numbers. Anyway I'm Looking at S-02n3's, Goodyear D3's, or pilot sport ps2's. Never drive in the rain. put about 2k a year on my baby. orig 16in rims. Never Track- simply enjoy on winding back roads(and any corner I can find). Any input would be greatly appreciated.







BruceWard

Lifetime Member





USA

2427 Posts

Posted - 12 Apr 2005 :  12:16:37            

My only suggestion is to go with 225/50/16 front and 245/45/16 rear instead of the factory 205/55/16 and 225/50/16. I think the wider tires look and corner better than factory sizes. Although the larger contact patch may make a little more noise.







Anchorman

Lifetime Member





USA

3411 Posts

Posted - 12 Apr 2005 :  12:24:40      

Since I'm very pleased with my Yokohama AVS ES100 tires, I'll say no more. Of course, I drive in all weather, and put about 10x more mileage on my "baby" than you do.







Grant

Silver Member





USA

647 Posts

Posted - 12 Apr 2005 :  12:51:14      

What is it that you hate about your Yoko's? Noise? Lateral grip? Rough ride? Durability?





That's a good starting point to bounce off of, either for advice here or for comparisons using TireRack.com's excellent content.





19bwb67

Starting Member





USA

16 Posts

Posted - 12 Apr 2005 :  13:12:43      

Lateral Grip Stinks in my opinion. I used to have a 944. I put some dunlop d40's on it and it was like night and day compared to the mid level goodyears that were on it. The yoko's simply do not seem to have the cornering ability I have grown accustomed to. They seem to slide out way to easily.







19bwb67

Starting Member





USA

16 Posts

Posted - 12 Apr 2005 :  13:15:23      

BTW the current yoko's are EVS models I don't think they are the es100 or at least it is not denoted anywhere on the tire that I can find.







RPM

Bronze Member





USA

335 Posts

Posted - 12 Apr 2005 :  13:24:43        



quote:

Never Track- simply enjoy on winding back roads







quote:

They seem to slide out way to easily.





Perhaps you are not being completely honest...



'93 968 Coupe Amazon Green Metallic

'89 944 S2 (gone to live in IN)

'77 911S (RIP)



BruceWard

Lifetime Member





USA

2427 Posts

Posted - 12 Apr 2005 :  13:24:51            

With only 2K per year why not put on Victoracers or those new Dunlop R compound tires that are supposed to last a long time.





I have heard Victoracers are good for about 5K miles of street driving on a 968.



Although street tires typically get noisy before they give, Victoracers are fairly silent as you slide sideways.





Anchorman

Lifetime Member





USA

3411 Posts

Posted - 12 Apr 2005 :  13:25:15      

I've driven on my Yoko tires at Watkins Glen and was quite amazed at the cornering grip. So, either they're quite different from yours, or my standards are really low. I'll say, though, that the instructors were also pretty impressed (with the tires, much less so with the driver).







19bwb67

Starting Member





USA

16 Posts

Posted - 12 Apr 2005 :  13:28:52      

typo AVS not EVS. also I just looked on tire rack and they are not the es100's the tire tread pattern is way different







19bwb67

Starting Member





USA

16 Posts

Posted - 12 Apr 2005 :  13:30:31      

Not sure what u mean RPM

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[flash]

tires are possibly the most subjective thing you can do when it comes to changes on your car - often people blame thing on the tires, when it is really other factors



www.tirerack.com does a good job of comparing tires in many areas, both objectively and subjectively - if you take the time to figure out their site and the tools there, you can really get some good information



i have no specific reference for you on 16s, but if you can get them in the right sizes, S0-2s are phenomenal - S0-3s are great, but can wander with the wrong alignment - the Yokahama AVS ES 100 is making a lot of people happy - the new Bridgestone S050 is another good one to check out



inflation is everything on these cars - a pound or two off and your experience will be completely different - be very careful there - sidewall construction is a key component to determining what pressure to run - tires with stiff sidewalls need about 2-4 pounds less air than soft ones - chalk your tires when you get them to determine what to do



alignment is extremely critical on these cars - a tenth of a degree and things change - you should be getting an alignment done every year - these suspensions do not hold spec very well - make sure they have the right tools (eccentric tool, 27mm and 36mm thin wrenches) and set your ride height, and do it all with the car nominally weighted (driver, half tank, etc)



pressure and alignment will affect your handling a lot more than variance between brands of performance tires

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[19bwb67]

thanks for the reply flash.i have been on tirerack and have researched extensively. reviews seems to be overly positive. prob because the tire were still relatively new when reviewed. I keep a close eye on my tire pressure and had the car aligned last year at the dealership. BTW- i am not a track driver-nor have i taken any classes. I just seem to remember my 944 holding corners like it was on rails. and the yoko AVS Db's seem easy to fish tail.

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[flash]

no problem - some of this you may know - some maybe not



i don't know about your dealership, but the ones here don't have good techs - those guys have long ago moved on - also, they won't do it with the car weighted properly, and almost never address ride height - that single factor changes things dramatically - a .5 inch difference in ride height results in a 75# change front to rear



stock specs are extremely conservative - if you have a strut tower brace (really good idea) then you can really start to take advantage of what this car can do by playing with the specs



do you have a cab or hardtop? pressures are different between the two because weighting is different front/rear between the two



i don't know anything about the particular tire you are running, and they may indeed be wrong for the car, but what pressures are you running and how did you come to those numbers? did you chalk them?



is your suspension stock?



all this will help with a recommendation

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[19bwb67]

all stock everything cab 90k mi., 36psi according to manual. no chalk- what is that?

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[flash]

chalking is an easy technique for determining correct tire pressure - what you do is run a chalk line left to right across the tread - then you go drive the car - then you look at the wear of the chalk - if it's even all the way across the tread, you're good - if it worn inthe middle, then you're high - if its worn more at the edges, then you're low



as a note - my pressures are currently 34 rear and 34.5 front - i am 100# lighter than stock though in the rear and am currently on stock size 17" S0-3s - tire wear is extremely well balanced



i'm not sure where my pressures will go with the new tires on the new wheels - likely down a pound or so becaue they will be much bigger but lower profile - still S0-3s though

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[SANDOVAL]

I have used several different sets of tires over the years. I always end up going back to the SO2 the best tire in my opinion. The handling and stickyness of this tire has always been the best IMHO. I also like the look of the tire. It is very aggressive again IMHO. Another thing the SO2 is about 1/2-1 wider then all of the other performance tires which is great for performance driving. I highly recommend the S02... I was unhappy with the SO3 and eventually went back to the S02.

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[19bwb67]

thanks. How do they get away with different widths? isn't the "225" in 225/55 r16 mean it is 225 millimeters wide in tread? I would like to go wider(all things being equal my assumption is wider = more cornering) Also lower profile perhaps.I want to stay with the 16 in rims. The AVS es100's seem like a bargain. But I am vasilating between saving a few bucks and pure performance. Seeing how I only drive her 2-3k a year The price difference seems small. except if I get stuck with a tire whos characteristics i dislike for the next 5 years. FLASH tell me more about tthe strut brace option is this expensive/worth it? Sandoval- have you tried the goodyear d3's? how about the es100's

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[Greimann]

The Yoko ES 100's are a great value. They have slightly less grip at the limit that the pricier tire, but for your stated driving demands I think they would be a good chioce. I have them. The DB's that you have now are for a quite ride on a sedan, not know for performance.



I wouldn't worry about corner balancing or the last 1/2 PSI pressure tuning. That is for is for 10/10 th's or even 11/10 th's' driving. A strtut bar is a good improvement, really tightens up the front.

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[Anchorman]

A little more info for you about the strut tower brace. IMHO, by far the best handling improvement I've made to my car. The KLA brace seems to give the best value, although there are some owners that want a different look. IIRC, about $140, and about 5 minutes to install (well, maybe 10 - read the instructions at least twice, and look at the relevant parts, and then do it right the first time. Doing it wrong has resulted in hood bumps).

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[flash]

agreed on the strut brace - www.klaindustries.net



i agree with dave about the 10/10ths thing - just getting the ride height correct though does many things in handling improvement - a lot more than you would think - i wasn't referring to real corner balancing - it also helps in braking - also, the half pound thing is the extreme, and likely only something you would notice when you really get into the suspension - but a 1 lb difference on these cars, even stock, is very real - i have been amazed at how much of a difference it makes



i posted alignment specs here for different setups



if those tires are what he says (and i believe him) then just going to any performance tire will help - the yokes are a great bang for the buck and unless you are really going to hang it out on the edge, probably as far you need to go

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[WYLDCTZ]

I have the Goodyear G3's and love them.

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[rustech]

[quote name='19bwb67' date='Apr 12 2005, 03:06 PM']I just seem to remember my 944 holding corners like it was on rails. and the yoko AVS Db's seem easy to fish tail.

[right][post="3187"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post][/right][/quote]



944 was extremely underpowered (N/A), and hard to power oversteer. Your current tires probably feel like cardboard. Any new tires will probably feel MUCH better.



I have tried Toyo Proxes, Michelin N3s, Kumhos Supras, and now Yoko ES100s. I am very impressed with the holding ability of the Yokes thus far.



If you really want to increase your handling, take others advice and buy the strut tower brace, and consider going with 17" rims to shorten the sidewall and get more meat under the car.

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[19bwb67]

thanks for all the input. Wasn't there some discussion about wrecking the structural integrity on the cabs if braces were used or am i confusing this mod w something else.From my research I found out that The AVS Db's were supposed to be touted as low Decibel ie quiet tires hence the Db designation but after talking to yokohama. They told me that the tires were found to be extremely noisy especially on heavier cars (bmws -were mentioned specifically) so they quickly updated them to the AVS Db2. The yoko rep said all they did was link the outer tread pattern together to quiet the tire. Anyway A tire that was being touted as "being quiet" is not the first thing I look for in a performance tire. I now that anything I put on this car with proper alignment will blow the avs db's away. Not being a talented driver, I really appreciated the old dunlops on my 944 ability to give tremendous feedback and super controlled rear break away characteristics. I could manage any fishtailing precisely but simply using the gas pedal. These Yokos get way out of control before I can compensate. It was suggested to go with wider tires/lower profiles- Any Thoughts- and how to tire companies get away w such variances in tread width. If i'm buying a 225/50 r16 I expect it to be 225!

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[Greimann]

Go here for Tire Rack's section on browsing the Yokohama brands.:

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/yokohama/yokohama.jsp



Each tire has some reviews from people who have driven them.



The 225 is actually the section width, not the tread width, and yes they do vary widely from brand to brand. I had a set of Contnental's that were marked 265. When I replaced them with the 275 Yokos, I measured both as mounted on the same wheel, and the 265 Contis were wider than the 275 Yokos!



There is tons of info at tire rack. It takes some diggiing, but well worth the effort.

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[19bwb67]

yes, I'v been there-lots of good info. i've spent hours. Anybody running wider tires/lower profiles on 16in rims? I would love to hear your thoughts

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[flash]

the problem you will run into with oversize tires is sidewall flex - this depends heavily on the particular tire you choose - if you choose a stiff sidewall, like the S0-3, you should be fine, if you choose a soft sidwall you may get gushy in corners - inflation plays in here too, as does the actual width versus the specced width - there is no real easy general answer - the individual tire choice is key - there are guys like bruce who say they are having no problems with a plus 2 size - the other end of the extreme is my new jeep, with a plus 3 size from the previous owner, and the thing is squirrely



i agree with eric that going to 17s will more quickly address the oversteer issue - to that point, check out the parts for sale section here



if not, then add the brace, change the alignment specs, and pick up any of the performance tires - you'll see dramatic improvement

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