[968Syncro]

Chris (coloradocab) wrote: The tiptronic, "...but it's proven to be quicker than ever 6spd it's ever faced ".

Here: http://www.968forums.com/index.php?showtopic=9152

I love my tiptronic, and am also happy with the performance, of course in manual shift is just a bit higher performance. I recall one of the books I own had a quote from one of the 968 engineers who worked on it during the 968 development phase. Something like the 968 has such a broad torque curve, you really need only 4 speeds. But I can't compare to the 6 speed. Obviously with a manual/clutch, there is some opportunity for some fine-grained car control, but Chris, I found your statement really interesting!

Figured this might be worth some discussion. Any comments?

Roland

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[coloradocab]

In pure 0-60 terms, of course the tip is slower, but on the track and in autocrosses, I've never found a 6spd that can keep up. Perfect redline upshifts every time in manual mode without lifting (I manually downshift), and fewer shifts in a lap are surely factors. You do pay a weight penalty, as the tip weighs more than a 6spd tranny, but I have lots of evidence of this particular car being very quick. Having said that, would I like a 5 or 6spd tip? Absolutely. I seem to recall a quote from a Porsche factory driver that he thought the fastest way to drive a tip was in full auto-mode, left foot braking, and triggering downshifts with throttle blips. I've tried it, but I still prefer having it in manual mode, myself.

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[rxter]

I drove a tip Saturday for the first time. 95K miles. The car was in better shape than mine in almost every way, particularly suspenders and steering. It felt plenty quick, but I kept mashing my left foot into the floor - looked like I had Tourettes or something.

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[flash]

i suspect the car is not the reason somebody is doing well in a tip

i like my tip, but there is no comparison to a 6 speed, if driven well - certainly you can drive the car fast, but there are some pretty big torque holes, and the tip can't take advantage of some of the mods as well as a 6 speed - of course mods make for an apples and oranges situation too

a tip has a higher drivetrain loss than a 6 spd, which means about 8% less power to the wheels - the weight penalty doesn't help either - the lower rev limit is also a hindrance - i also wish there was a gear between 2 and 3 and one between 3 and 4 - i find myself constantly out of the torque band

that being said, i REALLY like driving the tip - mashing the pedal at 70mph , having it drop a gear or two, and take off like a shot, is quite a rush - it is also a real pleasure to drive without the constant effort of shifting

i'm glad i have both - i like both - but they do have different characters

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[94SilverCab]

I had the pleasure of driving Flash's white Tip car.

I had no trouble with driving in full auto (other than the tourettes like syndrome described earlier)

I didn't like driving hard into a curve and not knowing what gear I was in, couldn't be sure I was in 2nd...I know that would get better with time, but scared the $#@! out of me a couple of times.

Jay

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[Fox944]

The auto in the 68 is a great transmission. Would make a fine DD, But it's not a Sequential Manual like Audi's DSG. With that said, i can shift my car faster then the Auto will & i have more gears.

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[flash]

they're getting good at this - the 997 tip is quicker than the manual

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[coloradocab]

And the PDK is even better. I'd say stunning from my experience with one in a Panamera Turbo.

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[968 GUY]

Since I bought the tip in June 'o8 (my 1st 968) it had been at my Dad's house in Ga. I drove it from Ky/Oh border to Bainbridge, Ga., Parked it, flew back to Wa. and basically haven't driven it for 2 yrs. Dad would take it to town on occasion, and had to drive it for a couple of weeks after a tree fell on his truck./He has been kind enough to keep the 968 in the garage./ moved back to Ga. recently, parked the 6-speed I bought from PorscheG96 and have been driving the tip. Really like it. The car is deceptively quick and smooth. Once I got the shift map out of Granny mode, shifting is fun, either in man mode or auto. Really like the kickdown to 2nd from 4th when I punch it...(to get out of a potentially dangerous situation of course).
Now I have it up on the stands doing inspection and cleaning and fixing up all the little things that got overlooked or that bother me.

Just a sidenote...the sunroofs on both cars have broken guides where the metal lifting arms and gears go. The tabs that the clamp hold to are broken and the guides wobble around. The tip was so bad that it threw the opp. side lift arm out of alignment with the sunroof guide and messed that up also.
I am trying to find some new pieces now...
I had to completely redo the lift roof on the 951 due to a broken cable guide at the motor and kinked drive cable...was using the 6-speed as a reference when I noticed that one side of the roof on the 6-spd was not pulling down as far as the opp side. I had take the lifting guides apart and noticed the broken piece. Then I noticed the same on the tip. Hopefully will find pieces soon.

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[gryphon]

If someone could crack the tiptronic software (and modify same) it would be a dynamite tranny.

Tom

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[Fox944]

Tom,

That shouldnt be difficult. Many manufacturers make tranny chips for diff cars. There are tranny chips for the Tiptronic transmission for my 2004 Audi A6 4.2, Shifts gears much quicker and also holds them longer. '

I'm sure if there was enough demand...RS Barn could/would make one.

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[flash]

the problem is the limits of the flex dampener

i'm sure the software could be gotten around, were somebody industrious enough to crack that computer, but there are things like timing changes that occur at shifts, to prevent sudden shock loads from getting to the rubber of the dampener - this unit is already prone to heat and stress failure - i don't know that it would hold up to harder shifts at higher rpm loads

unfortunately, this is the only car this unit was in - every other car got a different unit, and so we have no hard data on its capabilities or lack thereof

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[SHA-JR968]

Ok, eventually it's all a matter of taste.

But I personally would never consider a 968 tipper as an option.

Some arguments against tipper

- the 968 6 speed g/box is one of the finest - why miss it
- the power of the 968 is already relativly low - why further depreciating it
- sportscars should be manually shifted -> more fun
- fuel consumption should be considerable lower

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[mkdavis]

I love my 968 and it comes with a tip. I dream about a pdk, but then I'd have to park the 968. That's a dilemma. Would I want a 6 spd? Can't say; I haven't driven one. Drove my brother's early 911 where a transmission wasn't an issue and my overarching experience was how quick the car was. Now there's a thought: carve a few hundred pounds off a tip equipped 968 and get ready to....smile!

Every spring for the last 10 years I've brought my car out from under the cover and then spent the next couple of months getting the feel of it all over again. It's like driving it for the first time, but with a sort of genetic memory. By mid-summer I'm wishing the engine was more powerful and that the tip shifted faster, but my car always forgives me for these thoughts.

I've had it at PIR one time. The instructor and I both did lap after lap in D. So what tip level did I get to? Maybe 3? I can't believe I ever got anywhere near 4 and there aren't any country roads 'round here empty enough to try (though I still do every summer and have had a couple of interesting conversations with the boys in brown as a result). So, to my way of thinking, I always have something to shoot for - the elusive 4th level.

But it all comes down to this: I may dream about a pdk, and I may wish for more power, but I love driving my 968 and it comes with a tip.

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[flash]

ok - i'll bite - what the heck is a pdk? (if anybody says "pizza delivery kid", i'm banning them for a week, because they could have just said "drummer")

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[mkdavis]

porschedoublekluchenfastershifter

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[968Syncro]

Here is a description of the Porsche-Doppelkupplungsgetriebe...

http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13746_7-10061347-48.html

Roland

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[flash]

hmmm - ok - still don't get how they get to the "pdk" but ok (why the K?)

love the grammar:

"That may be a little confusing at first, but you is quickly adapted."

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[rxter]

It's German - different language with different rules. "kompressor" comes to mind.

"porschedoublekluchenfastershifter" [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/ohmy.gif[/img]) thanks for the chuckle

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[DaveN]

The "K" is the kupplung part. It is the 7 speed automatic that Porsche uses in everything now.
Doppel = double kupplungs = clutch getriebe = gearbox. 7 speeds and 2 clutches so no matter when you shift the 2nd clutch is in gear and ready to engage.

edit - my Germanic slip

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