[flash]

after a number of years, i realized my limitations. i also realized that in club racing, the guy with the most money usually won. not being one to bang my head on a wall too often, i decided it was best not to compete, knowing that i was going to lose. no point. they didn't have DE stuff back then. it was just the first 4 days before you got your racing license. so i just quit. never looked back either.



i never liked the race suit and all that anyway. too hot. i get overheated when the weather hits 80. not really any way around that either.

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[Cloud9...68]

I didn't consider the experience of riding with the instructor humbling - more of an acknowledgement that my car is really pretty fast, and at least reasonably well set up, with a lot of head room for my skill to grow into, which was exactly my goal with the project.

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[flash]

lol - i was young. it was humbling to see just how much i didn't know. by the time i quit, i was as fast as he was. i still couldn't keep up with some of the wallets though.

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[Rap]

Cool shirt does wonders with core temps, blew me away.

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[flash]

yeah - i know those things work. i tried them out when they were new. my problem is also at the helmet though. i have the same problem on the motorcycle (which is one of the reasons i'm selling it). i can't even wear a hat on an average day without getting overheated. it's just really an uncomfortable thing for me. when i raced, i had an open face helmet for that reason. i ran a single layer suit too (until they required a 2 layer one). i also had no windshield (just a 4" piece of plexi). i had as much air rushing over me as possible. even then, due to the time of year, it was difficult. i rarely raced in the summer, and instead only in spring and fall.



yes, i realize that living in southern california is at odds with this. i complain about it all the time. i can't make any real changes right now though. i may move to ireland, which will resolve that, but it's a bit off still.



this is the slippery slope though. you start by taking out your street car. then you set up a dual purpose car. then you buy a trailer and build a track rat. then you start racing. it's a real commitment, whether by your choice or those around you - lol. thankfully i escaped just before they locked me up.

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[ds968]

Tracking the car just one day was enough to make me give up that idea, and never consider it ever again . The biggest issue was the helmet, I can't stand wearing that thing even for 30 seconds. So will never track the car unless the helmet requirement goes way. Second issue : I need to go FAST ( notwithstanding turns, if I don't hit at least 150 mph or more at some points on the track, racing has no appeal to me)

But again, I could tolerate it just for the occasional fun of it, if it wasn't for the helmet.

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[Cloud9...68]

Funny, I've never driven on a "fast" track - going 150 in a straight line sounds incredibly boring to me. Driveway Austin is just the opposite - there's practically never a point where you're just going straight - even on the fastest parts, where a prepared car could probably hit 130 mph, the track meanders, so you always to pay attention to hitting your marks, or risk being out of position at the end of the "straight" where you need to be as stable as possible when braking hard. Now the helmet thing, I have no comment on - makes me feel like a racer - how cool is that, lol?

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[flash]

lol - anything in a straight line is boring, and i've gone over 200. i find there is no sensation of speed in a straight line. there is also no challenge until you hit well over 200. risk, sure, but no challenge.

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[ds968]

[quote name='flash' timestamp='1415745895' post='163605']lol - anything in a straight line is boring, and i've gone over 200. i find there is no sensation of speed in a straight line. there is also no challenge until you hit well over 200. risk, sure, but no challenge.[/quote]



To each his own.. I find nothing fascinating about twists and turns. A big yawn for me.

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[flash]

interesting. maybe you just aren't driving fast enough through those twists and turns. they require reflexes, skill, control, advanced planning and nerve.



high speed straight line requires only that you don't drop ketchup on your shirt.



now, if you want to go out to the salt flats and rack it up to 240 or better, we have something to talk about. under 170 in a straight line though is a big snooze. the only thing to spark adrenaline there is whether or not the police or a rabbit spoil your day. might as well be nascar. go fast - turn left - go fast again - turn left again. yawn

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[Rap]

The mental processing which is required over an entire track with different turns, cambers and elevations is what is cool for me. Try adding a Hans device to a helmet to increase the discomfort. Although they are supposed to have developed a new light helmet.

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[ds968]

[quote name='flash' timestamp='1415759251' post='163609']interesting. maybe you just aren't driving fast enough through those twists and turns. they require reflexes, skill, control, advanced planning [/quote]

All of the above skills are acquired in minutes. One track session with an instructor and two laps later I did all that in my sleep, and can still breeze through that, but it simply holds no interest for me whatsoever . No matter how fast the turn and how much you push the car's limits .. Maybe 150 + on a track is not all that exhilarating but when you do that on a highway it separates the 1% men vs the 99% boys that chicken out at about 130. And that's consistently the case- the majority of drivers, even experienced track drivers will not pass that magic 130 mark ..it must be the proverbial wall, psychologically. Going over 200 mph on the salt flats would be great !! Right up my alley.

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[Bulti]

"All of the above skills are acquired in minutes."



Jeez DS, I'm sorry, but if that were to be true, you should stop what you are doing and start a racing career right away.

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[Rap]

DS perhaps what you say is true for the track you were driving on but try going to a new track and see the difference. In DE that would mean most people would go from the beginners group to the advanced group in one day and this just doesn't happen. Most professional drivers when asked generally respond that it takes them a little more time than your two laps later declaration. Of course they are just professional race car drivers and not You!

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[94SilverCab]

[quote name='ds968' timestamp='1415758883' post='163608']

To each his own.. I find nothing fascinating about twists and turns. A big yawn for me.

[/quote]



DS, if the twists and turns make you yawn I think you are driving the wrong car. A Hellcat would be perfect for you..



JMO,



Jay

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[flash]

lol - i was with dan on that track day. we couldn't go all that fast. there was too much traffic. i've been on that track, in the same car, and gone a whole lot faster. anybody who has ever been on a track more than once knows that he didn't even get close to acquiring those skills on a first day, let alone in minutes. that's one of the major points of this thread. it takes a LOT of track time to even begin to be able to drive fast on a track.



there is no challenge whatsoever in going fast in a straight line on a highway (other than the above mentioned constabulary and vermin - wait, is that redundant?). i've driven the same roads as dan, at much higher speeds. there really isn't any challenge. i've gone over 200 on hwy 5. i've done 170 on 280. big deal. i got a bit of a "woohoo" because i was doing something bad, but that's about it. it was about as challenging as sitting in a rollercoaster car. the first time you ride that ride, it's fun. after that, it's boring. maybe it's his own limits that he is pushing, which generates the rush. maybe he just lacks the skills to go fast enough on the track to ever get to that point. if he spent more time on a track, i think he would find that he hits those same limits at 100, coming into a turn while jockeying for position in that turn with 3 other cars, and then trying like hell not to go flying off the track on his way out of that turn, only to figure out he has to do the same thing 3 seconds later. i think could hit the nail on the head. he needs to take a ride with a really good driver. i'm pretty sure it'll scare the bejeezus out of him and make him rethink his position.



this could easily be a perspective thing. people who don't play golf don't understand how difficult it is, and what keeps bringing people back. they just think it's boring. you have to do it for a while to really get it. you can't sit on the sidelines, or just do it once, and expect to have any sort of comprehension.



that being said, i know some salt flats drivers (including a world champion). that's a whole different world, and crazy scary. what you have to do there just to qualify to be allowed to make any top speed runs is brutal. people flip cars all the time. been there done that. thanks but no thanks.

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[94SilverCab]

My reply to Dan was pretty much tongue in cheek. I think we all grew up with muscle cars that had a fair amount of horsepower that could roar and burn wheels and go (reasonably) fast in a straight line.



My life changed the first time I drove an Opel GT and my friend with a vocabulary about Koni's and sway bars and Cibie headlights, I was transformed. My focus changed to Rx-7s, MR-2s, etc. You can only drive so fast on any given day, but I drive curves and corners every day.



I often tell friends that my car doesn't go the fastest, but it doesn't need to slow down either <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/smile.png" class="smilie" alt="" />



Have a great day!



Jay

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[ds968]

Bob, first of all , at Fontana you did not even come close to matching my times. Eric was witness to that and he said I was walking away from your car on every single lap. Furthermore , you might have driven 200 mph on highway 5 ( in the Daytona I presume ) but I seriously doubt you drove in the 968 anyway near the speeds I have, on the same roads. As for my acquired driving skills at no point did not say I was able to master the ability to RACE , that's a whole different animal and I would not be so bold as to claim that I could possibly compete in that environment without a lot more learning , time and practice; I was merely referring to the skills you listed, in the context of a controlled DE event such as the one mentioned above.

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[Cloud9...68]

To me, the exhilaration of track driving is the concept of holding the car on a razor edge between maximum speed through the corners, and losing control. That, combined with the mental challenge of weaving all the turns, straights, and meanders of a track into a seemless unit as rap points out, makes it the most enjoyable activity I've ever tried. I can only imagine adding the element of several cars simultaneouosly jockeying for position, with the requirement to do all of the above on a non-optimal line to get by someone. I usually agree with DS on most topics, but this one have me shaking my head. Respectfully, of course. To me, comparing driving fast in a straight line to negotiating the endless challenges of a road course is kind of like comparing Formula 1 to a drag race (go right past NASCAR, do not pass Go, do not collect $200).



Edit: I just saw Dan's post, which he must have put up as I was typing mine. If this was your first time on a track, and you were even close to posting respectable times, you have truly missed your calling, as you must have other-worldly natural talent. And that is NOT tongue-in-cheek. It took me two solid weekends before I even learned the track I first started doing DEs on, and it was at least a half-dozen sessions before I first passed anyone.

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[ds968]

Yup, I did grow up with muscle cars and there was little choice but to go only quick in a straight line . And I say quick instead of fast because you really could not go really fast -in spite of having the power to probably go 160 or more, at around 120 mph, most of the cars I had would get really light and probably get airborne, lol. I had a Maserati also, with which I could turn ( somewhat ) but that car was pretty slow by comparison so other than the looks, not particularly a great car.

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