[stewhatch]

Kim - is diesel still cheaper then reg. gas in Canada?

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[Cloud9...68]

It will be very interesting to see what happens over the next few years, as the mandated 35.5 fleet average mpg law goes into effect by 2016 (wait, never mind, the world is going to come to an end at the end of 2012 [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rolleyes.gif[/img] ). Given the 4-6 year automotive product development cycles, the manufacturers, particularly the domestics, were caught flat-footed when gas prices soared in 2008. They'll be ready next time with much more economical cars, including different varieties of electric vehicles. The question will be, how many people will buy them? As the one who predicted diesel as the fuel of the future, I've opted out of the prediction business. But I will say that there's definitely a lot of concern over safety in this country, particularly with all the behemoth SUVs that will continue to inhabit our roads for many years to come. It's definitely going to be interesting to see how this plays out...

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[Walker18]

Lots of discussion on sheet metal usage and weight, but the Smart Car has all plastic body panels. Basically, the roll cage, engine and axle are the culprits to the vehicle's weight. I am impressed that the safety requirement was addressed initially in the conception of this car, the roll cage. Everything else was built around it, and being the size that it is with the short wheelbase, the center of gravity must have been addressed by adding a certain amount to the lower center just to keep it from rolling on aggressive cornering, no? The wheelbase stance looks alittle bit like a skateboard, and appears to perform like one.
I think the concept to production on the Smart Car is innovative and a long step towards our endless goals of fuel consumption reduction, use of recycled materials and vehicle space concerns in cities. Congratulations Kim on your recent purchase, and wishing you many miles of smiles with your new ride!

Now with that being said, my brother and I attended the Philadelphia Auto show last year and had the opportunity to sit in a Smart Car together. That wasn't pretty. Besides the room being more that we thought prior to climbing in, we felt that it wasn't for either of us. Separately in the car it would have been tolerable for a short while, like commuting to/from work/home, but as for a trip, nfw. And sitting in it together, we were door, shoulder, shoulder, door. My brother is 6'1, I'm 6'3". I feel that there is more room in the Mini than the Smart. I know the fuel consumption differences, but personally I would pick the Mini just for the fun and quality build factors. Hey, different strokes for different folks.

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[Kim]

Diesel and 87 octane gas are about the same - they oscillate back and forth with one being more that other other by 2-3 cents and then vice versa.

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[moses]

About weight, horsepower, mileage:

I bought an (original) Honda Insight a few years ago. It's basic construction is pretty high tech, aluminum and plastic with an astoundingly complex body. 1850lb including AC and the hybrid drive (~125lb incl battery, motor, and power electronics). It's fully modern in terms of crash protection, airbags, ...
3 cyl maybe 65 hp gas engine with ultra-lean (22:1) mix (under the right circumstances)
10 hp electric boost which mostly makes it more drivable since the engine is tuned for top end
weirdly-spaced 5 speed manual gearbox
0-60mph is maybe 10 or 11sec, not exactly sure, but it's surprisingly not bad
55mpg overall since I bought it, and I drive it like I stole it

A sales bomb for Honda, probably a lot of reasons, one being that Honda wanted a halo car, and couldn't make money on a car that cost $30k to build but only $20k to buy (guessing here but all that aluminum and fancy engineering doesn't come cheap). But mostly people just don't give a rat's ass about burning oil, which is shameful IMHO.

I think it would take another step in design (tandem rather then side-by-side seating, plug-in hybrid, ...) to get 80mpg without really sacrificing performance but it's a tragedy that as a society we're not doing those things.

It's also funny how much fun it is to drive compared to the Porsche. The difference is that I can actually drive the Insight at 90% of its limits on public roads (carefully) but to get the Porsche to that point is tricky and dangerous, if not outright reckless. I can toss the insight around turns (throw away the electric steering booster and it's got great feel), grab a gear for 4 or 5000 rpm and control the understeer as if I were driving a 60's mini cooper, half skidding on the skinny high efficiency tires. The Porsche is great but the Insight is just a gas. BTW, at the point that each of the cars lose traction in a turn the 968 (stock suspension) has way more body roll than the Insight, kind of funny.

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[Kim]

all gooned up.
   

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