Hello
Just advice really if anyone has got Leda suspension fitted to there 968, i have there adjustable oil shockers, the car has standard 17 cups and bridgestone S02 tyres, had total alignment checked .
However the car seams nervous at speed, not holding the road well.
Firstly has anyone got leda fitted and what do they have there suspension set up as, the knob has 24 presets.
secondly any advice why she feels nervous, i have tried tyre pressures etc with no major success.
Kind regards
Simon
968cs, leda suspesnion,strut brace,airbox mod,promax chip
Hi,
The chasis is very sensitive to alignment. Try adding caster to enhance the directional stability. Also, the alignment specs call for toe out, which can make the car feel darty but enhance turn in. The shock valve position is usually set to be around half way up the adjustment, add damping until the car suspension does not bounce after going over a road irregularity, when you get to the "sweet spot" the suspension will settle in about 1.5 cycle. Finally check your tire pressure. Ive been fiddling with my suspension for a while and feel that Im getting to were everything feels right, Ill let you know my final settings.
Jpr
[quote name='ordy' post='29036' date='Dec 14 2006, 05:42 AM']Hello
Just advice really if anyone has got Leda suspension fitted to there 968, i have there adjustable oil shockers, the car has standard 17 cups and bridgestone S02 tyres, had total alignment checked .
However the car seams nervous at speed, not holding the road well.
Firstly has anyone got leda fitted and what do they have there suspension set up as, the knob has 24 presets.
secondly any advice why she feels nervous, i have tried tyre pressures etc with no major success.
Kind regards
Simon
968cs, leda suspesnion,strut brace,airbox mod,promax chip[/quote]
I can't help on the Ledas but it sounds like an alignment issue or possibly a bad suspension bushing.
I have the LEDA double adjustables on my 968 race car. I vary the 24 position adjustments front and rear for both bump and rebound quite a bit depending on how I want the car to handle. I've never seen varying adjustments on the LEDA's cause anything I'd describe as "nervous". I think you have something else going on. Can you be more specific on what the car is doing?
Ditto Jim's comments. The shocks have never made the car feel nervous to me and I drive it often on all kinds of roads. Seems something else may be at work.
FWIW, when we first installed them... the rear torsion bar bushings turned out to be LOCKED! The only damping was the tire itself. Even then, the car was obnoxious, but not nervous.
Hi
A few more details, that may help, the suspension is set just of middle setting, towards the soft side by a few clicks, if i increase the rear more than half the rear tends to hop around corners, as of the moment it holds corners well, even in rain it will slide, either end not breaking away.
The shockers are compression and rebound both adjusted off the same knob on the shocker,as of the car, the nervous feel is that it likes to change direction to easily so it hard to keep in a straight line on everything but the smoothest roads.
Can yo give me any advice what i should aim at for tracking and camber and toe adjustments, to make it less sharp at the front and more stable for road holding.
thanks for all your help
Simon
If you stiffen the rear shocks and leave the fronts unchanged, then you would expect the car to demonstrate more oversteer. I wouldn't call it "hopping", but you would expect the tail to step out more easily. I like my race car to oversteer a bit, so I usually run my rear LEDA's stiffer in the rear. If the rear is literally hopping up and down then something else is going on in the suspension, probably with the bushings. I suppose its also possible you could have something strange going on with your tires. What sizes are you running and what condition are they in? Are they the same age, make and model all around?
Regarding changing direction too easily that sounds like a toe issue. What is your toe setting? Is this strictly a street car, or does it see track duty? People who track their 968's like the toe set at zero, or slightly out. This makes the car turn in better. The compromise is that it can make the car darty and annoying to drive on the street. Setting the toe slightly in will cure the problem you describe.
Hope this helps.
[quote name='Jim Child' post='29085' date='Dec 15 2006, 07:43 AM']If you stiffen the rear shocks and leave the fronts unchanged, then you would expect the car to demonstrate more oversteer. I wouldn't call it "hopping", but you would expect the tail to step out more easily. I like my race car to oversteer a bit, so I usually run my rear LEDA's stiffer in the rear. If the rear is literally hopping up and down then something else is going on in the suspension, probably with the bushings. I suppose its also possible you could have something strange going on with your tires. What sizes are you running and what condition are they in? Are they the same age, make and model all around?
Regarding changing direction too easily that sounds like a toe issue. What is your toe setting? Is this strictly a street car, or does it see track duty? People who track their 968's like the toe set at zero, or slightly out. This makes the car turn in better. The compromise is that it can make the car darty and annoying to drive on the street. Setting the toe slightly in will cure the problem you describe.
Hope this helps.[/quote]
Hi Jim
Sorry for the late reply, been a bit ill, as of what i use the car for its purely street use, as of the toe setting i will try and find the reading, however i believe its set at zero, if it is what setting would you recommend me going to?
As of the tyre issue, they are all the same age and type, size 225 front 245 rear, standard cs size, tread depths ok as well, however i have suspected the tyres for a while as i ran 18 inch which michelins on, tyres seemed better, but car tram linned alot as the offset of the wheels where different.
I think the toe is what i should try first, as the car does feel darty,
Thanks again for all the advice.
Simon
I'm running full track alignment (camber/toe) and leaving it there for street use. On the street, particularly with Hoosiers (occasionally), it does tramline a bit and requires attention.
With street tires, it's FAR less noticable (have snows on right now and it's fine). Toe is pretty important, particularly under heavy braking. I'll have to try to dig mine up and see what we set it at.
Generally speaking, Leda's allow for a reasonably compliant ride. Mine do and I'm running obnoxious spring rates. If you lack compliance in the suspension for some reason, I would suspect a bushing not operating freely.
Hi Jim/Dave
Found the alignement results
Toe
Left +0.05'
right +0.04'
Total =0.09'
camber
left -0.05'
Right -0.08'
What do you think, would these results cause darting, handling?
Or should i presue the tyre route?
Any input would be a help
Cheers Simon <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/dry.gif" class="smilie" alt="" />
Interesting. I would have guessed your toe to be closer to zero based on your description of what the car is doing. You certainly have room for more toe in. I think total toe can go as high as .30' and still be in factory spec. I'd probably try more toe before buying a new set of tires unless you're looking for an excuse to get rid of your old ones.
If I remember correctly UK and US alignment numbers are measured differently (hours/minutes vs degrees or something like that), Ordy are you in the UK?
Hi Mark
Yes i am, the land of high taxes
Thanks
Simon
Hi Jim
As you mention i could try more toe, i am in the UK and its measured in degrees, are my setting that i supplied you making the front edge of the wheel stick out as its a postive figure and minus figure make the font of the wheels point in, or have i got it wrong?
You mention i could try more toe, is that on the plus side or minus side.
Thanks Again
Simon
We measure in degrees too. Positive toe (+) is toe in which is want you want. You already have some toe in, but apparently could use more. Your total toe is +.09', but could be as high as +.30'.
Must be a Honda thing that all of the UK stuff I saw for the S2000 was in hours/minutes. It drove me nuts when trying to use the Honda UK specs which were better than the US specs until I figured out I had to convert the measurements.
Simon - what are your spring rates?
Thanks Jim i will try that, after the holidays i will have the geometry reset, will it effect tyre wear in any way?
Eric i will check what the spring rates are, however they are dual rate however i will check and get back to you.
Thanks
Simon <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/smile.gif" class="smilie" alt="" />
Hi Eric
The spring rate is 2.5I.D. 275LB 9 Inch eiback, they sound pretty soft to what some guys run, however the back roads over here are covered in pot holes, the rear is still torsion bar set up.
I think i will go down the toe route, any advice whether positive or negative camber helps stability at speed.
Thanks, And merry christmas
Simon
<img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/biggrin.gif" class="smilie" alt="" />
[quote name='Mark' post='29178' date='Dec 19 2006, 08:55 AM']Must be a Honda thing that all of the UK stuff I saw for the S2000 was in hours/minutes. It drove me nuts when trying to use the Honda UK specs which were better than the US specs until I figured out I had to convert the measurements.[/quote]
1 degree = 60 minutes != 1 hour
Again I'm not familiar with the Ledas, but I'm wondering if they are set too stiff for the stock torsion bars in the rear. Over dampening could be keeping the tires from staying on the road on uneven surface. Just a guess.