[Cloud9...68]

Interesting. I know there hasn't been a death in Formula 1 since Senna's in 1994, and before Dan Weldon's recent fatal crash, there hadn't been one in CART for quite awhile. It sounds like the amateur racing sanctioning bodies have some catching up to do - sobering stuff.



As far as highway fatalities, though, according to this article, speed is a factor is 30% of all incidents:



http://www.smartmoto...al-crashes.html



That's an awful lot of people stuffed into body bags as a result of driving too fast. It would be interesting to compare the odds of dying as a result of driving, say, >120 mph on a public road, vs. participating in an amateur race, per mile driven. Something tells me the race would be safer, but statistics on super-high speed driving on public roads (which is what we're talking about here) are probably hard to come by, so that's just a guess.



But when I brought up the comparison of the adrenaline rush from driving super-fast in a straight line on a public road, vs. the thrill of achieving very high speeds through a series of corners, I didn't mean to imply a racing situation. I was thinking primarily of a track day scenario, where the cars are kept a safe distance apart, and passing is only allowed under specific circumstances. The thrill comes strictly from the achievement of a good lap time as a result of mastering corner technique, as opposed to swapping paint with an opponent.

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[flash]

they always say that speed is a factor in crashes. i suppose technically that's true, since if you weren't moving you probably wouldn't get into a crash.



it's not the speed that kills as much as the lack of driver training. we let anybody have a license and many have no business driving, and certainly not at the speeds cars are capable of.



regarding DE events, i don't get much of a thrill out of those. when i started driving on the track, that was something you did for 4 days and then moved on to racing. the idea of continuing to do that makes no sense to me, unless you are just out there shaking out a car, but then i just rent the track to do that anyway and don't have to deal with anybody else. part of making good lap times for me is the competition. in find my mind wandering when i am not in the thick of it. i make mistakes when i get like that. typical type a i suppose.

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[ds968]

+ 1 on the " I had no idea " there were ANY track deaths or injuries, other than the two or three "famous" ones we heard about in the last five years... Still, for every 1 track death or injury there are 100,000 or more regular roads deaths or serious injuries so non-track driving is exponentially more dangerous than being on a controlled course, but clearly there are reasons for that ; people that have no business being behind the wheel of a car, texting, talking on the phone, putting on make up, eating, drunk, tired, or just otherwise clueless, and speeding where they shouldn't so it's a bit like comparing apples to oranges I guess,

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[Cloud9...68]

Flash,



I'm sure the thrill of competitive racing is exponentially greater that that from a track day event, and if I had the resources (trailer, vehicle to pull it, space to store them, and a boat-load of spare cash), I'd have been doing it years ago. But I actually get quite a kick out of just being on a track with other capable cars driven by ostensibly decent drivers, because even though it isn't technically a race, I still hate getting passed by anybody, and I love the feeling of being able to stay ahead of a faster car. For me, it's about setting and achieving goals - competing with myself, for lack of a better term. But I'm sure this will all seem like watching paint dry once I finally take the plunge and start racing, which has always been my life's dream.



As far as speed being a factor in highway deaths, I think it boils down to a few factors - reduced reaction time, greater momentum, more stress on mechanical components, and less margin for error. I don't think anybody could argue against the idea that if everybody drove at or below the speed limits (well below in the case of bad weather conditions), there would be far fewer traffic fatalities. But back to the topic, I think that's a big part of the thrill of driving at super-high speeds on public roads - the whole getting-away-with-something-dangerous-and-illegal thing. I used to do it, too, before I started tracking my car, after which I lost all interest in driving any faster than my 80-year-old mom.



Rhude,



Thinking about your roller coaster analogy, I disagree. The thrill of a roller coaster ride comes from the acceleration associated with the downhill parts, not the sustained speed, which is what you experience above, say, 150 mph - major acceleration is over by that point.

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[flash]

yeah - i'm just to much of a type a to do that. i like the strategy of when to block, when to pass, using other cars to achieve my goals, and of course beating out the other guy. i never had the mindset for DE, since they were only for training and then you had the big "N" on your car. i can enjoy taking the car out and flogging it, but it's really not much more than a sunday drive to me. you definitely don't get to go all out, and certainly don't get to be aggressive. i get it, but it's not for me.



we would have a lot less traffic fatalities if we required people to undergo defensive driving training and put them on a skid pad and taught them what the car does under unfavorable conditions. most drivers don't find that out until it's too late.



so, technically speed is a factor, it's really about the inability of the driver to manage the speed. some drivers shouldn't be going over 25.

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[Rap]

I took that driving class at Pocono last summer and was on a skid pad. Was pretty amazing to me because I had no idea that's what to see, and react to. Didn't know what could be achieved by braking. Hope that if I get in that situation my reaction is to use what I was taught!

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[rhudeboye]

"Thinking about your roller coaster analogy, I disagree. The thrill of a roller coaster ride comes from the [i]acceleration associated with the downhill parts, not the sustained speed, which is what you experience above, say, 150 mph - major acceleration is over by that point.[/i]"





Cloud- Actually you’re agreeing with me. The corners after the drop are "sustained speed" and as I said, it’s not as fun.

A coaster tic tic tics up to the peak of the hill, hangs you in anticipation, then lets loose. It’s totally the rush of acceleration (along with the drop) that makes the ride. Such is the case with accelerating in a car. As I said "Putting your foot in it and holding it" produces that rush. I wasn’t talking sustained speeds. I’m talking acceleration. It’s all the same.



“Major acceleration is over at 150” ? I think I know you well enough to say you’re no longer talking about the Veyron <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/laugh.png" class="smilie" alt="" /> but even in the 68, when I give it a good stab at 110 and run up to 130 it still gets the blood pumping.

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[Rap]

How frequently do you do that? I haven't had my car that fast yet. I agree the rush of the acceleration is the deal!

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[craigawoodman]

For everyone who loves to simply feel the acceleration - go and buy a big bore motorbike. It will accelerate quicker than a Veyron and will max out somewhere around 220mph. In terms of "experiencing" the acceleration - it is much more vivid when you are not wraped in a metal and glass tube.



The highest rate of acceleration is from stand still. So when you get up to high speeds, the rate of acceleration is like driving a Hyundai - so where is the thrill apart from the noise element?

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[Cloud9...68]

Yes, I also agree it's the acceleration that's the thrill. I admit I've never been in a car at anything near 150 mph, but I would think that even a Veyron's rate of acceleration between 150 and 225 mph is relatively "sedate" (if I can use that word to describe anything about a Veyron), at least compared to the rush of 0-150 mph, so the journey from about 150 to 225 would seem to be closer to the sensation of steady-state speed than to thrilling, snap-your-neck-back acceleration.



So, I come back to not understanding the attraction of driving at >150 mph. It seems like the fun is in the 0-150 acceleration. Might as well back off at that point, or, if you really want another jolt of adrenaline, stomp on the brakes! But I also understand that going >150 mph can be thrilling to a lot of people for all kinds of reasons, and I don't mean to judge what is fun for somebody else.



Edit: Craig's post came across while I was typing mine. Similar thoughts in different words. Good point about the superbike. Sounds like a blast.

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[robadams56]

I find it hard to love a car that has so many systems assisting the driver. And frankly, I think it looks like a bullfrog with bad gas.



The whole car experience is the full stimulation of ones senses. As far as supercars go,I would much rather have my butt stuck to the seat of a 959 flying the N-ring. At least I feel like its me driving the car and not the car driving me. Finally, who can argue with the beauty of a 959?

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[ds968]

Lol, I was trying to find a suitable description for the Veyron's looks...that's a good one. And also agree, so much technology takes away a lot from the driving experience, although if you go 250 mph in the Bugatti I'm guessing the heart beats so fast it's likely to dwarf all the other driving feedback senses.



I'm a 911 shape "hater" , but can't argue with the 959.

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[rhudeboye]

What odd collection of gear heads we are <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/tongue.png" class="smilie" alt="" />

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[Rap]

Odd being the key word!! Course that's what makes the world go round!

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[ds968]

If we were all alike in every respect, this would be one boring friggin' forum, wouldn't it ?



As for top speed, as much as I enjoy it, I just don't want my thoughts preoccupied with law enforcement when I should stay 100% focused on the car and the road. So for the last couple of years I have not taken it to those levels...and not sure I ever will unless the speed limits of the autobahn are adopted here. The only times I get to triple digits speed nowadays is on long highway onramps ( fortunately there are a bunch of those on hwy 280 , and close to my house ) where the chance of being "caught" is essentially zero, and by the time I enter the highway the car is back to a respectable 70 mph or so ;-) But the fun of going from 20 or 30 mph to often as high as 120 , is enough of a rush to get my kicks .

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[rhudeboye]

I'm with ya Dan. I love the sprint, even when its just in a straight line.

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[Samariter]

<img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/laugh.png" class="smilie" alt="" />

At home in Germany they do these kind of speeds every god-given day. Excess of 200 may be rare but everything else is common practise and legal !

What you need is reflexes and a good anticipation regarding behaviour of people in the slow lane. Autobahn is 2 lane most of the time but there are 3 and 4 lane pieces. Overtaking is only allowed on the left which makes things easier. Traffic is heavy most of the time but there are places where you can go these speeds for half an hour or longer.



The Autobahn is not a straight line and corners that seem to be very wide at 100 prove to be rather tight at 170.



With the experience that comes over time there is nothing much to it. The only thing is mistakes made at this speed are done twice - the first and the last time ... but as Flash said high speed accidents are rare ...

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[rxter]

Mays drove the Veyron to a record speed on Top Gear - great cabin shots - he was very excited.



I got pretty close to the 968's terminal velocity on a long, straight road on NM a couple of years ago. Was very exciting for the time it took to get there.

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[bombfactory]

I had a nice third and fourth gear pull up to 100 this morning getting on the freeway when a rare wide-open spot opened up. Don't see it often enough, but the car sounds pretty good at <acronym title='wide open throttle'>WOT</acronym> at 7000 rpm.

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[94SilverCab]

[quote name='flash' timestamp='1328917876' post='121680']

i like the strategy of when to block, when to pass, using other cars to achieve my goals, and of course beating out the other guy. [/quote]



Sounds like my road driving skills <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/smile.png" class="smilie" alt="" />



Jay

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