66 replies to this topic

[Kim]

As I see it, sitting here in Nova Scotia with no 968 any longer (that can change) but about to retire and looking for something to do, there just isn't much being tossed out here to help a potential "investor" - I use the term with quotations as I doubt this this qualifies as any investment - make any sort of a decision to potentially move forward. For example, and as brushed on by William Moss:

1. no idea of cost - it does matter. Maybe not the exact amount on line, but an idea. <$25K? $50K? more?
2. no idea of any possibility of any financial return, combined with
3. current owners placing restrictions on what new owners can do with the site in terms of charging fees, dues, etc.

Based on that, there isn't much out there to entice someone to take a step ahead.

Someone like me, just as an example, might have the time but have no idea what is being asked in terms of $$. If the $$ was better described, that person might be able to team up with others (much as you did with Jay and Pete) to form a team to share the risks and work. It seems as though a team could be assembled based upon the responses so far.

I think that a bit more info is needed here to "separate the sheep from the goats".

[Inkedupfatboy]

1. no idea of cost - it does matter. Maybe not the exact amount on line, but an idea. <$25K? $50K? more?
2. no idea of any possibility of any financial return, combined with
3. current owners placing restrictions on what new owners can do with the site in terms of charging fees, dues, etc.

Exactly what I was thinking. )I know I said I would shut up, but as long as someone else threw it out here first)...I have the time, but not $25 - 40K..If I did, the wife would make me put it on the mortgage,. or I would be buying another car what ever it would be.

If you are selling it, and getting out, it is not fair to place your requirements upon the new owner. If you walk, you walk. That is like me selling my car and contracting the owner to not driving it over 50mph or on Sundays.

I am also curious that we have not heard anything about this from Jay, or if he is just letting you drive.

Ok, Shutting up again. - Sorry.

[flash]

i get all of that guys. as i said, when i have it all together, i will release it. i haven't done the books yet. this thread was not intended to advertise or discuss the details of the sale on the site. it was more a notification that it was coming (note that it is in the announcements section and not the classifieds). if somebody wants to discuss it, they can send an email, and from there it will be on the phone, until it comes to the sales agreement.

as for placing our requirements on the buyer, it is absolutely fair. it is nothing like your analogy. this affects a lot of other people, not just you. if you had to draw an analogy, it's more like placing your pet with somebody else, than selling a car. we will only sell it if we know that it will be run essentially the way eric first set out to run it, and how we picked up and continued. if it won't be run like that, we'll just kill it, rather than let it go downhill from things that we already know destroy sites. under no circumstances would we let it become another RL. member fees are at the very root of why that site doesn't work for most 968 owners.

as for the rest, it will be handled off line. when the package is ready to put out there, it will be sent, along with non-dosclosure agreements.

in the meantime, i recommend that if somebody is thinking about this, that they put together an idea of what limitations they have, and look into assembling partners. then, when the package is ready, we will have something to talk about.

[flash]

p.s. - jay is just sitting back while we sort all of this out. not really much to talk about yet.

[Inkedupfatboy]

Sounds good. Thanks for the clarification.

[flash]

no worries. we just wanted to do the right thing, and let people know what was going on.

as for the rest, it's not all that different than when eric was selling the site. he had certain requirements of the new buyer too. he wanted to be sure that his vision had a reasonable chance of success at continuance. we feel the same. after putting a couple thousand hours into this site, not counting any time posting, i feel entitled to try to see that the thing i built goes on reasonably intact. of course the new owner would be free to tweak things. that's great. things must evolve. but, the important part is that the data is easy to get to, organized like an encyclopedia, and that the site is always free to join, free of spam, hopefully free of misinformation and bad advice, and free of the bickering that has destroyed other sites.

it's no simple task, that's for sure. but i think somebody will step up. it will probably be a team though. not too many people can dedicate large blocks of time. i can't anymore. it has already cost me too much in missed work. it's my own fault, but it's time to fix that and move on.

[Rap]

So for clarifications sake, once you put together the information that is necessary for people to look at and make a determination, you will then post that info and requirements on the site? At that point, any interest by potential buyers will be conducted over the phone with you. Does this sum it up?

[flash]

not quite. those who are serious can send an email. then i'll send a phone number. then a preliminary conversation will take place. if that seems to go well, then we can start talking financial details.

this may sound overly complicated, but again it is more important than anything else that we find the right new adoptive parent, so a certain amount of screening will be necessary.

[94SilverCab]

Just to confirm that I am not out of loop on this discussion I will offer a brief perspective.

There has been far too much discussion on this thread already. Bob should have simply put up a For Sale sign and locked the topic. There are several interested parties and we will consider all serious offers. While we do have a bottom line, our primary consideration for a viable candidate(s) is the ability to maintain the data and integrity of this site, our consistent mission for over 6 years, and for Eric before us.

The individual(s) who would be viable for the purchase of 968Forums must have (or the ability to acquire) at a minimum:

• Technical skills to support, upgrade and maintain the forum software and to solve issues quickly.
• Time to focus a concentrated effort toward responding to issues both technical and toward maintaining proper cataloguing of information and “decorum” of the forum.
• Business acumen to negotiate contracts with suppliers and sponsors. Coordination with tax filers for yearly annual statements.
• Ability to answer basic technical questions regarding the care and maintenance of the Porsche 968.
• Additionally, you should have the ability to organize and support local events for the benefit of the community.

Honestly, and with all due respect, if you are searching for financial rewards, you should excuse yourself from the table. This is a passion; you will never be compensated financially for the hours of effort making a feature work properly, or the time spent on the phone resolving issues between individuals, or researching better ways to do things. We came into this project with no expectation of ever making a profit and we have exceeded that expectation gloriously. That said, I have never met a group of finer individuals than I have been privileged to meet through this site, the experience has been incredibly rewarding.

Unlike Bob, I intend to remain an active member of this group and I hope to keep my 968 for at least a few more years. My wife and I are planning a long and happy retirement that will begin sooner than probably most of you would expect, and involve years of world travel, my time has always been limited, and it will become even more limited as the plan moves forward. Given Bob’s desire to move on, this is the right time for me to step out of the way and turn this site over to the next steward(s) of the encyclopedic data on this website.

Regards,

Jay

[Carl968]

Thank you , Bob. Your opinions, expertise, knowledge and dedication to this site will definitely be missed. I, for one, have gained a tremendous amount of info about these cars and how they work. Your products as well as your input have been first class. I look forward to seeing this site continue with the professionalism that you and the partners maintained.
Thanks and good luck on your next endeavor.

Carl

[williamoss]

Out of curiosity who are the current owners of the site, as I hought it was only Flash and maybe Pete? To know those names, we would then be able to contact those owners and not just be posting in this general mail box. i for one like the fact that this site is free to all, but now you are asking someone to put up $40-50 K with no return on his investment. I am sure when the site started no one expected it to grow to the amount that it did and no one thought it would require such a giagantic effort to keep it roling. I would be happy to pay a modest amount yearly to have access to the site, around $25 a year. Perhaps when the site was started, it was started with the idea of a free site, But is that the way to go in the future?

William Moss

[flash]

jay and myself are the owners.

all communication regarding a purchase must go to 968forums@gmail.com, and not to either one of us.

we knew how much work it would be. we also knew how successful it would be for the members. there were no surprises there.

this site must always be free. that is exactly why the other sites are less successful. they are either buried in ads, or charge a fee for full access, or don't have adequate monitoring.

as jay said, this will be a labor of love. it can easily support itself, if somebody is prepared to do the work to make that happen. personally, i have had to draw lines on how much time i can dedicate to it. i could have sought out more advertisers, if i had the time. there could easily be a profit stream there, that would not cause the site to be buried in ads, nor require membership fees.

as jay also said, discussion of this here in this thread is moot. he is probably right that i should have locked the thread. really this was merely an announcement. i left it open just to be able to explain why we are doing this. it was not so that anybody could pop in and say "i would do this" or "why don't you do that?".

any conversations regarding purchase must first be via email to 968forums@gmail.com. we will then go from there. if you are interested in purchasing, feel free to email us. if you are not, then please keep your ideas to yourself.

[Kim]

Based on the last post, Over and out on this one.

Edited by Kim, 03 December 2013 - 03:03 PM.

[rxter]

I sure hope Black Forest continues to know how to fix these cars.... kind of feels like a Sun is exploding and the bits will be sucked into the resulting black hole.

Again, thanks for the opportunity to share and learn from y'all.

Over the past 5 years I've really enjoyed Scott's sense of humor, Kim's discourse on miles, miles, miles, rhude's goofy avitars, cloud's kindof racecar saga, Dan's endless libido, and Rap's complete love affair with the 968. Mostly I'll miss the guidance and support that I've needed to put the car up on a proper jack, take off the batwing (front apron) (front apron), and install Canton oil filter (finally). I'll even miss Bob's rants. It's been fun guys - maybe time for that Z4...

As one long-time and long-gone 968er might say,

Good luck - Bob Blackwell

[flash]

roflmao - i wondered how long it would be before some idiot on RL made a wise crack about the sale of this site.

[94SilverCab]

roflmao - i wondered how long it would be before some idiot on RL made a wise crack about the sale of this site.

THE idiot!

Hilarious,

Jay

[flash]

p.s. - to address the points the idiot mistakenly assumes:

the membership here is actually quite active. while i can't easily pull up specific numbers on a member by member basis, i regularly purge dead or incomplete memberships, so as not to artificially inflate that number, and have looked at each member periodically. i would estimate that about 30% of our over 2000 members have posted in the last year, and more than 50% have popped on and read. that is actually a very good level of activity, and per member far exceeding that of any other site with 968 content. our number of posts in that year was over 16,000. views was over 160,000.

revenues have been deliberately limited. we did not want the site to be laden with ads. we only sought out enough advertisement to cover physical costs. we were essentially operating as a non-profit. that could easily change. it would not be hard at all to pick up other advertisers. this site could easily make $10000 a year profit, without requiring members to pay a membership fee.

[flash]

lol - another pot shot - funny - i love the numbers he spouts. even in non-profit mode, we do way better than he quotes. don't let that guy near your books. no surprise though. i think that guy must have a major mental crisis going on. it's that or he must be looking at it in the same mirror that makes him look skinny. no worries. no surprises.

i am assembling the books and media kit, and everything a buyer would need. when i have the conversations, i can help with marketing ideas. i've had a plan for that all along, but just don't have the time to implement it. it will be very easy to ramp things up so that the site makes money. however, it is not enough to justify my time, given what i make elsewhere. i have to prioritize, and this site is never going to make $1000 a day, so i can't spend the time marketing it.

the key to success though is going to be providing the same level of support and information, which is so far above and beyond any other site. if the new owner drops the ball, and ignores the site, or lets it be run like the others, then it will fall into oblivion like the others, or worse, be run by the cuckoo's nest.

but, that is exactly why we are carefully considering any potential owners, and exactly why we feel that a group would probably be best. but, we will consider each situation individually, and try our best to provide the optimal situation going forward for the membership.

[Byte]

Sad to see. Best of luck.

[PorscheDude]

Bob, You have done a fantastic job over the years not only with this forum, but the 968 community as a whole. You have accomplished so many great things and created some awesome products over the last 10 years or so.
I'm sad to see this day come but, I understand that when the day comes, it comes.

Best of luck to you and I hope the right people come along to carry this torch in the right direction.