77 replies to this topic

[flash]

lol - bomb - the addiction to which you refer in the last paragraph is a pretty common feeling. the 968 owners fall into basically 2 groups.

group 1 - those who love the car, and don't care what it cost to make it the car they want.

group 2 - those who thought the car would be cool because they wanted a porsche, but had no idea what it takes to get one, get it up to snuff, or maintain one

some owners shift from group 1 to group 2 as they fall in love with the car. others lose interest due to the reality that these cars are not trouble free by any stretch of the imagination. it is only a matter of time, and all too often it is a brief period, before the car needs thousands in service. even when you do get that service done, if you leave it stock, you are left with a car that is not competitive in today's market from a performance or feature standpoint, and has little to no resale value.

i have said it before, and i'll say it again. we are seeing old tired cars go away, clean low mileage examples gaining ground, and the rest are becoming hobby cars that most people keep. i think we will see another round of changeover over the next couple of years, as people let go of their pipe dreams in favor of logic, which will shake out the remaining viable cars. then they are going to get pretty hard to come by in any sort of decent shape.

the good news is that those who want a project, will be able to get one for less. it's already happening. the bad news is that you won't be able to get a decent car going for under $25k.

[bombfactory]

Flash I think I have one foot in each group. After a half-dozen BMWs, I decided I wanted to try a Porsche for a second, weekend 'project' type car. I've never really been a 911 guy - don't fit in the older ones and can't afford the newer ones - but I've always liked the the looks of 924-944s and the 928, so once I discovered the 968 existed, it seemed like the perfect choice. I like driving a car you don't see on the road every day.

I've enjoyed learning about these cars - and now that I think about it, if I hadn't been having all these problems, I'd just be driving the car and not learning so much about it. Because of the limited resources I'm able to divert to it, I'm doing more work myself on the 968 than I've ever done on any car before, and when I complete a project successfully it feels very rewarding (ok a lot of the problems are still ongoing, but still!). Plus I've also had the opportunity to meet and interact with the 968 community - you guys - and that has added a whole new aspect to the ownership experience that really keeps me enthusiastic about this whole deal.

Flash, that $25k figure is looking pretty close in my case, maybe just a tad low :-)

Edited by bombfactory, 01 July 2013 - 11:21 AM.

[flash]

yeah - i went conservative. i know plenty who have spent more, and plenty who will spend a lot more.

[psuphoto]

Just typed a long reply moments before hitting return, windows 8 restarted... Ok here goes again. I think I've always been in category 2. When we bought it in 2004 (98,000 miles), it was so much nicer than any of the $15k 911's. It drove like a dream in comparison. I spend about $1000-$1500 a year keeping it going, based on the other comments in this forum, that sounds reasonable. Car now has 130,000 miles. And would be a daily driver except Red oxidizes quickly in the Florida sun, so it needs to be frequently waxed when not in the garage. If I were to do it over, I'd spend more time and look for less conspicuous color preferably white. Red was perfect for my mid life crisis in 2004. Logic, time and limited funds are starting to slowly prevail.

[paulzebo]

Bought mine on the cheap also knowing it would keep me busy(Group 1 guy-those who love the car, and don't care what it cost to make it the car they want ). Just picked up a rebuilt cylinder head, Std rod bearings, rings and a pair of good cam cores with the veriocam mechanism for $1000. The 88,000 mile head has the old valves, new guides, full valve job and less than .010 surfaced from the head. The seller was getting out of a 968 project he no longer had time for. Still looking for a block and crank. Then a supercharger. My goal is to bring it back as close to new for retirement. Once the engine is done, on to the trans and torque tube. Then the suspension, new interior, more money, more money and even more money. Do agree with Flash on 968's eventually going up in value. Bang up one fender and the car is totaled by the insurance companies. A local Phoenix yard has 6 of them up for sale as "parts cars". Of the 4600 brought into the country, I wonder how many are still on the road? If rl968 waits long enough, he will get the money he's asking for. In the meantime, I hope he still enjoys the ride.

[hot968]

this sounds crazy but the truth is I could have purchased many beautiful 968's for the price I paid $15.000, in 2012 for this 968. I can't figure out why I only wanted this car and it is a mess I am doing nothing but pouring money into repairs and maintenance items. I don't even drive it much as there is always a problem the latest was a bad leak in the hatch-solved by installing new hatch seal- and learned a lot about it. I have done a lot of the work myself and have to say I love it. SOOOO would I buy this messed up neglected-it sat in a barn for 8 years no protection- I have to say yes but don't ask me why?? If u buy one on the cheap u would probably do ok but don't over pay for one that needs work- unless u really love it

[ds968]

I dunno...unless you want to drive a Japanese car, the 968 will still need a lot less maintenance that pretty much any other sports/GT car half its age that you could buy for under $50k..

[psuphoto]

group 1 - those who love the car, and don't care what it cost to make it the car they want.

group 2 - those who thought the car would be cool because they wanted a porsche, but had no idea what it takes to get one, get it up to snuff, or maintain

As I think about it, there is kind of a group 3 (group 2 people that are in denial, because they want to believe they are group 1 people). Those that bought it from a reputable Porsche Used car dealer. Were told it would not take nearly the maintenance that a 911 takes. In fact, were told it's a 944 with more HP / Torque and without any of the repair problems. Had little tiny suspicious issues, but only after the car warmed up. Then realized the Throttle body was leaking on the Alternator.... blah blah blah.... After the first couple of $K got it running nice. but for every 1 thing that gets fixed, two more things are either suspicious or could be fixed.

Not sure the price will ever really go up unless the demand goes up. The supply continues to decrease, but except for those on this forum, I don't believe there is sufficient demand.

[flash]

lol - yeah - there are those who "claim" to be passionate about their 968, and say they will do what needs be done, yet push off maintenance, and neglect the car. those are the ones who end up selling it after 10 years, saying things like "i never drive it". in reality, they don't but it's all too often because it needs work and they know it.

i agree that the price will be at least slow to rise. it will all depend on the rate of attrition. it was never a loved car by anyone, especially porsche people. that will work against it. it doesn't get a lot of attention. that will work against it. there aren't a lot of support structures for it. that will work against it.

i am tracking things though

[mbardeen]

944s and 951s are starting to track up in value. Those were loved(?) cars and cultural icons (at least to those of us who are children of the 80s). As the 968 represents the ultimate evolution of that line, I think (hope?) it might appeal to those nostalgic for the 944 series.

But like Flash said.. we shall see!

[JWahlsten]

I guess I pretty much fall into group 1, but I must have made a pretty good purchase as well. My car really has been reliable. I have done maintenance to it, but most was preventative. The only think I can think of that actually broke was one of the amps for the stereo. I could have just trashed it, but for less than 100 bucks I got a used one. Been working perfectly since. I drove it daily in Florida for two years without a hiccup. It's an absolutely fantastic daily driver. My biggest knock on it is the damned radio reception. Not a big deal to me. I have an i-Pod.

Sure I do lots of checks and tweaks to the car, but I drive it on the track occasionally. If you're going to drive it like you stole it, you better maintain it or it's your butt... So, I pay close attention to fluids, brakes, bearings, and scheduled maintenance. I typically end up changing things a lot more than someone who does it solely on mileage.

Long story short, I've had two of these. Both have been reliable, but no more reliable than my other 3 944/951s. They just take some knowledge and upkeep. If you buy a well maintained one, it will save money in the long run, and track mileage really isn't a factor. I had a good PO and the shop that took care of it knows front engined Porsches.

I'm not betting on values going up tremendously, and my car is over 100k making it less desirable. I think the 100k barrier is significant as a mental barrier for many people looking at these cars. The ones going up in value are low mileage examples from what I've seen.

[Cloud9...68]

I think the 100k barrier is significant as a mental barrier for many people looking at these cars. The ones going up in value are low mileage examples from what I've seen.

Yes, couldn't agree more. Many people say they'd be happy with a higher mileage car that's been documented to have been well maintained, but when it comes down to it, I agree that the ones holding their value are the lower mileage examples. This makes sense not just because of the psychological barrier of a high mileage figure such as 100K miles, but by definition, low mileage 968s are getting rarer every year.

[rl968]

I've come to the conclusion that while these cars are rare and getting rarer, they are just not desirable to a wide audience. 100k is not a barrier on 911s. The price of my mid-80s 911 3.2 has gone up 50% since 2009 and it has 105k on the clock.

[Cloud9...68]

You have a point. When these cars were new, I remember them finishing dead last in car magazines' comparison tests against cars like the Corvette, RX7, Supra Turbo, and the Nissan Z. Underpowered and overpriced, unfortunately. I bought a new car in 1993 (this was before we had kids and we could actually afford new cars), and I didn't even consider the 968 - I bought an RX7. I've grown to appreciate the 968 over time, and recognize that with the right mods, it can be made to be a capable all-around performer. But the fact that it was such a dismal failure in the marketplace, and stacked up so poorly against its contemporary competition, doesn't bode well for its future valuation.

[hot968]

psuphoto, there must be a #4 which is me- I love the car BUT I care a lot about the fortune and time on repairing it just to keep it running and restoring to true 968 grade

[rl968]

Lets try this again...

http://www.cars.com/...onal&listType=3

[paulzebo]

It would definitely make it on my "to call" list when I was looking. Nice.

[psuphoto]

Very similar to mine, age, mechanical condition. I hope you get this much. I'd be happy to sell mine at that price. Keep us informed.