[flash]

war on drugs - funny - if it were a war, we would be able to capture and/or shoot dealers and users on sight - hmmmm - maybe that's not such a bad idea - it might actually have an effect - food for thought, but then i'm a bit of an extremist anyway when it comes to crime and punishment



i'm sick and tired of people saying you don't have a right to complain if you don't vote. hogwash. i choose not to vote because i don't believe the system works, and don't wish to waste my time. it isn't because i don't vote that it doesn't work either. it's because the system is designed to fail. as long as you allow money and special interests to enter the equation, and allow politicians and lobbyists to make their living from the process, then the system will not work.



i would move out of the country to a different system if the weather weren't better here. but then too, as churchill said, "except for all the rest", so i'm not sure where i would go, or that it would be all that different anyway.



i could really care less about national politics. it really makes no difference what happens there. we get into wars now because of money, not morals. we cheat the poor, the elderly and the sick for the same reason. if it were otherwise, we would not have the unemployment we have now, the homeless we have now, and the debt we have now. it is only because we allow the big corporations to continue to profit uncontrolled, and we allow the hand-out machine to continue to go without getting anything in return (at least post WW2 we had the unemployed working in public works for their dole). i see no significant change in the last 40 years that i have been paying attention, regardless of which party or who is in power. for all the posturing and media nonsense, it's pretty much the same thing regardless of who is in office.



local politics, on an issue by issue basis are different, and sometimes directly affect me, therefore i get involved in various campaigns.



the bottom line for me is that i just don't find much of it to be all that important to me. i reserve the right to complain, because i can see the answers, just like most people witha head on their shoulders. but, we will never see those answers come to reality, because it would put too many people out of a job. they aren't going to put me in charge either , so things aren't going to get much better. lol



frankly, i think i'd like to see the whole thing crash and start over. the way things are going elsewhere in the world, i may get my wish too.



who-boy! i need a drink now

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[Rap]

That's what's great about freedom of speech, you get to say what you want.

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[flash]

lol - yeah - i gave up on the whole thing a long time ago, and am just waiting for the big implosion. i figure either we will blow ourselves up due to poking our nose into something with some nut-job we let live because they might have oil or something, or mother nature will wipe the place clean again. either way, it really won't make much difference who is in the white house.

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[rhudeboye]

[quote name='flash' timestamp='1320620960' post='117636']





i'm sick and tired of people saying you don't have a right to complain if you don't vote. hogwash. i choose not to vote because i don't believe the system works, and don't wish to waste my time. it isn't because i don't vote that it doesn't work either. it's because the system is designed to fail. as long as you allow money and special interests to enter the equation, and allow politicians and lobbyists to make their living from the process, then the system will not work.



... we get into wars now because of money, not morals. we cheat the poor, the elderly and the sick for the same reason. if it were otherwise, we would not have the unemployment we have now, the homeless we have now, and the debt we have now. it is only because we allow the big corporations to continue to profit uncontrolled, and we allow the hand-out machine to continue to go without getting anything in return ..



i reserve the right to complain, because i can see the answers, just like most people witha head on their shoulders. but, we will never see those answers come to reality, because it would put too many people out of a job.

[/quote]



<img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/BowToFlash.gif" class="smilie" alt="" />



"who-boy! i need a drink now"

COOL, I'm buying

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[Rap]

Agreed its congress that implements legislation and votes it in. Can even override the white house! Course it would be nice to have a knowledgeable leader not a perpetual candidate

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[tamathumper]

The American Republic will endure, until politicians realize they can bribe the people with their own money. -- Alexis de Tocqueville

@Rap, on November 4th, a new iceberg 308 square miles in size started calving off Antartica. It's the size of New York City, so there should be plenty of room for your parents. <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/wink.png" class="smilie" alt="" />

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[ds968]

Any forum members in Denmark, Sweden, Norway, Finland ? It would be interesting to hear their opinions on the political and economic environments there. Not that we could possibly draw a comparison between the U.S. and any of the countries mentioned, or think that if something works well there it may work here as well - the size, demographics, and every dynamic involved is so vastly different it would be likle comparing apples to...light bulbs, but nit seems most of those countries have managed to strike as close to an ideal balance between capitalism and socialism as can be attained, a population which in spite of paying what we here in the US would consider outrageous tax rates appear to be more content with the quality of their lives than the rest of the world, health care which no one can find fault with, economies that continue to prosper in the midst of a global economic crisis and corporations that are both socially and environmentally responsible and who value employee well-being almost above all else while managing to remain sufficiently profitable and keep investors happy, and the candidates who run or hold governmental office postions seem to be rational human beings unlike the collection of nut cases in this fine land of ours. How is this possible ?! Again, not to compare, but it would be interesting to know if what we read or hear from people who live there is indeed a system that works, or is it as screwed up as we are here, just on a smaller scale ? And how do you feel about voting, btw ?

p.s. No one from Holland need reply why you're happy.. we all know the reason ( scroll to the thread which debates cannabis legalization , lol )

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[Cloud9...68]

Funny you should mention the Scandanavian countries. One interesting characteristic about their system is that despite massive government expenditures on their cradle-to-grave benefits, they actually have a very low rate of debt. They have the good sense to realize that if they want a system where their government takes care of most of the citizens' needs, they need to pay for it in the form of very high taxes. To me, the thought of forking over that large of a chunk of my income to the government sounds horrifying, yet they seem to make it work over there. Bottom line, they seem to realize that if you want something, you have to pay for it.

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[Rap]

DS I did open this thread to non US forum members in the hope of soliciting views from abroad. Not Scarlett of course. Flash are there any female members of the forum? Hate to continue to be PC incorrect! Can you imagine asking people to pay more taxes as our services continue to be cut because we can't afford them. I continue to notice help wanted signs across a wide swath of my area. I hear other employers tell me when I ask that they have trouble finding people to work. These aren't jobs where the skill sets don't match. Now I grant you that these don't represent the best jobs with the best wages but often opening the door is the avenue for advancement for many employees. It is in our company. When I dropped out of law school back in another time and on another planet I was forced to take a job as a bus boy for $3.25 with no benefits in DC. I marginly survived. Would have starved without the food that was the one benefit the restaurant offered. I worked as much OT as i could.i have little sympathy for those that wont do what they need to do not what they want to do. It was a huge drop in income and certainly in face. I did it because I had to. Do unemployment benefits discourage folks from working jobs they consider beneath them?

Flash how do I adjust my clock for daylight savings time?

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[flash]

we have a few female members. they seem pretty thick-skinned about the commentary



no idea on the clock. i'll look.

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[rhudeboye]

I was talking with a friend over the weekend who has taken a job at an after school learning center for young teens. He is underpaid and over qualified. He's only teaching basic stuff. However their is a lot of overtime that bumps his wage to time and a half. So he's working 12 hour days to make ends meet but still must simplify to stay afloat. Because the time he spent unemployed caused him to amass a decent amount of debt. Truth be told, he might not had even got that job had he not knew the CEO of the learning center.



Government seems to have little compassion for the people they're serving, the people paying their bloated salaries. True, there are those that milk the system but the majority want to be employed and useful to society. But the economy is taking a beating and even government jobs are on a freeze. Mean while the leaders of the country go about their days bickering with one another and spending millions of dollars in an attempt to prove the other political parties inadequacy. Even refusing to agree with the other side at the peoples expense. If they're not looking out for their people in a time like this, then why are they there?

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[KesslerR]

I try to vote in all elections. Its the feeling that if I do not vote, I can't complain. Its easy now as we have the ballots come by mail.

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[Rap]

Rhud no doubt a rhetorical question when asking who they are looking out for eh? Regardless of how your friend got his job or what it is, is he happier now that he is working? OT may be tough but what would it be life without it? Now here is someone that can be respected for going out and doing what he needs to do. If everyone did this things might look better. You can't swing for the ball if your not at the plate!

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[tamathumper]

"Even refusing to agree with the other side at the peoples expense."



I'm often confused by this statement. If, as a debater, your party feels the other side will bankrupt the country with their actions, is it not your duty to disagree, debate and if you can, disallow their actions? I've heard this kind of comment a few times this year used to deride the Republicans for "not agreeing while the country suffers", but it looks to me like they're just standing by their principles.



I'm not siding with the Republicans or the Democrats in this case, I just don't really see how agreeing against principle would be better.

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[Rap]

It doesn't of course. It is merely the empty rhetoric the the one side uses to to place blame on the other side. Sort of like if you blame someone or say something often enough it takes on the semblance of the truth. And if no one says hey that's not right then enough believes it is. Certainly is easier than trying to deal with and explain the truth.

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[968Syncro]

Apparently Italy is going down, real fast, right behind Greece. Reminds me of when Bear Stearns went down in Mar. 2007, and "evidently" it was nothing to worry about -- until 6 months later when those in the know already made themselves safe. USA-nians are getting good at holding up pretenses -- oh, let's rearrange the deck chairs! Anybody got info about Italy's financial condition vs the US?



I suggest the most important items to have will be a dirt bike and at least 20K in cash (no what you need is never what the govt tells you: water, batteries, band aids, and canned food) -- yes, mobility will be everything when the roads close and the US and state govts becomes ineffective. Probably also should stock up on whiskey and bullets, these are currencies that always work (and a Vanagon!). Oh, did you really think that the government union workers will stick around to help you in a dire crash? What? -- you thought the ATM would be working?

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[ds968]

Sure it may get a lot worse before things balance out again , and they will , but I'n not so sure we all need to put a downapayment on an underground survivorlist shelter in Idaho yet ;-)

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[biotechee]

Crap!!! Late to the game again!



Wish you had told me that yesterday...



Anybody looking to buy an underground survivorlist shelter in Idaho on the cheap? PM me!



Bullets and whiskey? Nah- you need lots of young children. Somebody's always looking for someone to mow the lawn, pull some weeds, paint the fence, clean the garage. The Duggars will rule the Earth - you watch.

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[Rap]

My god $20,000. Do you really think that's enough? That's chump change. Keep it in a safe place and get it before the banks close. Kids eat more food than cut grass. But I would feed my kids before me. Wait wait I forgot I'm already doing that! Do yo all remember in late July I asked the forum about what you all thought about liquidating your accounts around 8-2? Almost everyone thought that was a bad idea. Will the super committee find common ground or will auto cuts come into effect? Think this might happen around the same time this euro debacle gets a real head of steam?

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[tamathumper]

I'm fully stocked on Tactical Bacon.



http://cmmginc.secure-mall.com/item/CMMG...Bacon-1325

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