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change your belts!!!
#1

this weekend was the 6th Annual NorCal / Socal Paso Robles Fun run (you can read more about that in the events section)

i had been meaning to change my belts for the past few months - i don't drive the car a lot - it sits in an airconditioned and heated garage - i maintain this car in top flight condition - i checked the belts a few months ago and everything was great - in fact, i check the belts before every event (except this one) - so, i figured everything was going to be fine for this run

very early into the trip i suddenly developed a vibration in my shifter - also the car seemed to be off on power - when taking off from a stop, it surged and pulsed - when coming to a stop it stalled

at our first rendezvous point i popped the hood to see what was going on - knowing that i had just replaced the rubber plug that covers the inspection port of the distributor and saw that it was missing, and sticking out of it was a string from a belt, i immediately jumped to "ruh roh!"

i then pulled the front cover off to see the belts - what i found was shocking - the balance shaft belt was half gone - while it was still connected, it had split longitudinally - not wanting to risk further damage, nor be stuck in malibu, i then cut the belt, bumped the engine around, and removed it

after replacing the cover, i was off and running, but still very concerned about the vibrations doing damage - it was also no fun to drive - it was definitely down on power - even the exhaust note was off (frappier and louder) - the stalling was a real challenge - i had to blip the throttle on the way to idle to prevent it - had i have had the DMF, i might have been fine, but the revs fell too quickly with the 12lb flywheel - also the surging was annoying - clearly the engine was fighting itself with the masses being out of balance - again, the DMF would probably have masked a lot of that

now, keep in mind that these belts had only 23k miles on them, and they had been inspected regularly - retension was done every 5k - the problem was not mileage - they were 4 years old!

i got home ok, and there seems to be no damage, but i was VERY lucky not to have it snap, get tangled up in the timing belt, and have resultant catastrophic failure

moral of the story - replace your belts! these things age out - it's NOT about mileage alone

unfortunately ds968 was not so lucky

here is a shot of the belt:

   
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94 Midnight Metallic Blue Cab Porsche 968 w/deviating cashmere/black interior and WAY too many mods to list - thanks to eric for creating www.968forums.com



"It isn't nearly as expensive to do it right as it is to do it wrong."
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#2

OUCH!!!

Note that my recent balance shaft belt failure was on a belt that was not quite two years old, with only about 20k miles on it.

Someone needs to start making better belts!!!

Flash...
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#3

Wow, you and DS968 suffereing belt failures within days of each of other. My balance shaft belt stripped a bunch of teeth a couple of years ago, but I attributed that to it being the wrong width - it was a 944 belt. So I guess belt replacement is a serious matter in these cars. And here I was thinking belt failure was just overblown urban legend...
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#4

Down power, frappy and loud, almost stalling, and I still couldn't keep up... [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad.gif[/img]

Seriously, miles and months to change which belts? Can we go with the original Porsche recommendations or should we be a bit more paranoid?
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#5

Careful about 944 belts - not all, but I know for a fact that some Porsche dealerships have the wrong part number for the 968 belt in their computer system which has it identical to the 944 belt. At my last belt change my mechanic sent back the belt the local P dealer shipped him and then spent half an hour
arguing on the phone because they insisted they gave him the correct part based on what their computer showed to be a 968 belt. Even after he told them it's narrower than the one he just took out , so OBVIOUSLY it's wrong, they said that these are the "new" belts from a different supplier so they're the same now as the 944 but they're perfectly fine. He called another dealer and got the right one, but just be careful !

I heard Porsche no longer uses Gates, and they've changed belt suppliers to a "more economic" mfg, so the quality could also be compromised, but I have no confirmation of that ..just hearsay.. does anyone know what the real story is on that ?


Someone should post the correct part number for both belts to make sure when we or our mechanics orders them from the dealer or anywhere else for that matter we get the correct, and absolute best quality product.
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#6

I do not like this at all, makes me very uncomfortable to say the least. I am replacing the belts asap. But to what make? Kevlar belts would seem to be the best choice but who makes them, and who sells them?
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#7

What brand belt was this?
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#8

This has encouraged me to go ahead and check my belts, so I went ahead and did so today. Fortunately, they look to be in excellent shape, but the balance shaft belt was pretty loose, so I tightened it using Pete (from RS Barn)'s method of pressing it toward the pulley on the water pump, and setting it so that it begins to become taught just as it's about to touch the pulley.

I also noticed that with all the stuff off the front of the engine, the oil filter is much more accessible. So, I think I'm going to make it a habit in the future of checking my belts at every oil change. I drive the car about 5000 miles a year, so this will be a once-a-year event. Having the air box, etc., removed, will make it easier to stuff rags around the base of the filter to minimize the mess when I remove it. So, a less messy oil change, and the peace of mind that comes from checking (and replacing, if the time has come) the belts, sounds like a reasonable plan to me.
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#9

Is there any problem with the Contitech belts sold by the Paragon? I just ordered their kit for the 968. I have not done this before and I think I had read something about replacing a stud or a bolt on the tensioner arm. Is that a recommended thing to do? Thanks.
Dwight Anderson
94 Coupe
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#10

<!--quoteo(post=72105:date=May 18 2009, 02:13 PM:name=flash)-->QUOTE (flash @ May 18 2009, 02:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->moral of the story - replace your belts! these things age out - it's NOT about mileage alone<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Same for tires and any other rubber-based components [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/excl.gif[/img]
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#11

Just had the following replaced:

timing belt (Gates)
balance shaft belt (Gates)
all three rollers
idler pulley
crankshaft pulley seal
balance shaft o-ring
balance shaft seal
miscellaneous seals and gaskets
water pump (new OEM)
tensioner
heater valve
thermostat
fan switch

The damage: $2350

I asked for all the old parts and they are from a '93. Timing belt and balance shaft belt look PERFECT. No cracks, nothing. Water pump and roller look very good as well. You never know however, when one of those parts will fail and cause a chain reaction of failures. The car runs better than before, so smooth...

Good luck to all and thanks for all the anecdotal evidence concerning the belts. In the end I went with Gates.

Next Wednesday, I get my OEM 17" C2 Turbos back from Wheel Enhancement! I'll post pics when I get them.
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#12

my mech said if you track or autocross the car frequently, changing your belts even at 10k miles or after a year is not a bad idea. this would have sounded like overkill borderlining on crazy had I heard that a month ago, now I'm not so sure.

might be worthwhile " insurance "
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#13

Flash: from your pic, looks like the damage is one sided...maybe something got into the cover and caused the problem....like the missing plug....
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#14

it was a brand new plug - i just installed it prior to the run - not likely that it entered into the area - more like old age on the belts
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94 Midnight Metallic Blue Cab Porsche 968 w/deviating cashmere/black interior and WAY too many mods to list - thanks to eric for creating www.968forums.com



"It isn't nearly as expensive to do it right as it is to do it wrong."
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#15

Just double checked, I have dayco...not conti
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#16

Not sure why I haven't seen this tread before, but it really got me thinking about the timing and balance belts:



Mine were 3 years old this February, with 8.000 miles on them. Understand the milage is not of interest here, just age.



The statement that frequent inspection does not prevent a snapped belt means I need to take the car to the OPC now, even though I had the belts inspected this year.



The cam chain and pads were done about 3 years ago, so were the seals (I have no leaks anywhere), the belt rollers and all the associated bits and pieces. Also did the water pump at the same time.



The car is 20 years old now with 78.000 miles on it.



So, here's my question: What else should be changed while doing the belts on this particular car?
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#17

If they have never been done, I would consider doing the rollers and the water pump and thermostat, and I would inspect and replace the tensioner and mounting stud. If the seals are not leaking I would leave them alone.
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#18

[quote name='tamathumper' timestamp='1336559550' post='126710']

If they have never been done, I would consider doing the rollers and the water pump and thermostat, and I would inspect and replace the tensioner and mounting stud. If the seals are not leaking I would leave them alone.

[/quote]



Tensioner and mounting stud is noted, thanks. I need to check the receipt from 3 years ago to see if those parts were changed as well.



The rollers, thermostat, waterpump were done together with the belts about 3 years ago. <img src="/forum/images/smilies/968/smile.png" class="smilie" alt="" />
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#19

Sorry, that should have said "inspect and replace if necessary" - stupid #!*@&$ iPad.
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#20

FYI- keep your eyes and ears open... A little birdie tells me that a racing timing belt is coming out for the 944... It wouldn't suprise me if the 968 is right behind...
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